2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

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TheScientists
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2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by TheScientists » Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:15 am

We will be hosting a Discord Tournament based off of NHBB/IHBB packets on 4/18/2019 @ 4:30PM PST.
Sign-up here: https://forms.gle/qD6oWqwH3jQM14dz9
Join the tournament center after sign-up here: https://discord.gg/Qre5bjT

Let me know if you have any questions!
Thanks
Ameya S. - Laurel Springs School (2017-)

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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by TheScientists » Fri Apr 19, 2019 12:49 am

The preliminary tournament has been wrapped up!
Results are attached here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing
The playoffs will be on Monday, April 22nd @ 6PM PST on the Discord Server (link above). The Wildcard game will be at the same day at 5PM PST.

Special thanks to Wesley Zhang, Dean Ah Now, Lewis Fuller, and Rishi Raman for helping run the tournament.

Also - the preliminary set for this tournament will be made public on quizbowlpackets.
Ameya S. - Laurel Springs School (2017-)

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jonpin
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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by jonpin » Fri Apr 19, 2019 4:22 pm

TheScientists wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 12:49 am
Also - the preliminary set for this tournament will be made public on quizbowlpackets.
Was this written by you (or a group involving you) in the style of NHBB? Because if, as seemed to be the case from the original postings, this was using old NHBB questions, #1 don't do that period, and #2 you absolutely can't post someone else's questions to the packet archive.
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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by Santa Claus » Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:10 pm

jonpin wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 4:22 pm
#2 you absolutely can't post someone else's questions to the packet archive.
2018 Glenwood Winter Teacher Quiz Bowl should probably be removed then, considering it directly rips questions from 2017 Prison Bowl, 2015 Potatoville Varsity, 2016 HFT, 2015 BISB, and 2012 Ohio State+VCU Housewrite.
Kevin Wang
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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by TheScientists » Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:13 pm

I probably should put a public clarficiation.
Based off of IHBB/NHBB packets is defined as basing our housewrites from the rossups tyles and type of topics that you would expect at an IHBB/NHBB match. Out of the 90 tossups we wrote, only 2 were direct copies and we redacted those 2 in the copies that have been uploaded to quizbowlpackets (currently pending approval)
Apologies for the lack of a public clarification.
Ameya S. - Laurel Springs School (2017-)

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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by TheScientists » Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:13 pm

And yes - the other 88 questions are housewrites. So will the Wildcard packet and Finals packet.
Ameya S. - Laurel Springs School (2017-)

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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by Santa Claus » Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:00 pm

I've taken a look through the first packet and found that the majority of questions have been taken almost verbatim from existing question sets. Considering that this set will certainly not be posted on the archives and did not charge a mirror fee, I don't think this warrants much more than a stern talking to, but please note that attempting to affiliate this set with NHBB or market it as a "housewrite" is disingenuous. If you're going to compile existing questions for a shootout, then don't try to act like these were written from scratch.
Kevin Wang
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literatureboye
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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by literatureboye » Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:26 pm

https://imgur.com/a/1ZeARt3
This was posted in the moderation chat before I left the moderation team.
Jordan Lee
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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by Fuddle Duddle » Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:48 pm

literatureboye wrote:
Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:26 pm
https://imgur.com/a/1ZeARt3
This was posted in the moderation chat before I left the moderation team.
Ameya, even with "editing" and the fact that this tournament didn't charge anything, passing off someone else's work as your own and dishonestly promoting it as such is highly unethical, and this attitude toward doing so doesn't bode well for either your involvement in the qb community or your future academic career. For your own sake and ours, don't do this again. Thank you to Jordan for bringing this to our attention.
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CPiGuy
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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by CPiGuy » Sat Apr 20, 2019 4:10 pm

For what it's worth, Ameya actually said in the Discord that he would be taking questions from existing tournaments and then editing them to make them "more competitive"; not sure what that means but guessing it's a synonym for "making sure nobody can look up the exact wording and then cheat".

Also for what it's worth, Ameya, if you take a question from a different source and repurpose it (for lack of a better word), that doesn't mean it's your question, and you still shouldn't be posting it on the packet archive as if you produced it. I would advise that you either take Packet 1 off the archive, or re-upload only those questions that are your original work.

Given the fact that Ameya was pretty open in advance about the fact that the questions wouldn't be housewritten (I was actually surprised that two of the packets were entirely so!), and he demonstrated his good faith in other ways (such as asking the Discord what to do if two of the questions in a packet were taken verbatim, and if he should redact them from the final posted version), I don't think it's reasonable to accuse him of acting dishonestly or in bad faith.

I would, of course, have a very different opinion if he had presented the set in advance as being entirely housewritten, or if money had changed hands in the process of this tournament.
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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by High Dependency Unit » Sat Apr 20, 2019 4:28 pm

Hey so it should be
1) Clear that this event is not at all affiliated with NHBB
2) Understood that you should never run a tournament on questions written by another organization without their permission, and especially do not charge an entry fee for those tournaments.
3) Understood that you can never pass off other people's questions as your own, even if parts of them are tweaked. This includes sets from the archive.
4) Understood that, even separate from the other issues, advertising a tournament as a housewrite and then using previously published questions is a terrible idea.

In addition, even if you were somewhat clear that some of the questions were not originals, that should have been explicitly stated in the forum announcement.
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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by TheScientists » Sat Apr 20, 2019 11:43 pm

A few clarifications:
- I just want to make clear that NHBB/IHBB has no affiliation or endorsement of the event. (This has been put in the first lines of the registration form and in the Discord server)
- I have made shortsighted decisions as to the creation of the first packet and clues in specifically that packet have been modified rips from old NHBB packets and from QuizDB. Jordan's screenshots are correct and there is no further context needed. The 88/90 claim is disingenuous due to the nature of Packet 1's clues.
- For the wildcard game and finals, we will be creating tossups from scratch.
- I will make sure that future online tournaments we run will be solely housewrites (and if not, be properly cited as such) and will be planned/run well in advance.
- Only the wildcard game and finals packets will be uploaded to quizbowlpackets and I've redacted the files for the Prelim questions.

If you want to see the Prelim packets, here are the google doc links:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/173Q ... sp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JiD ... sp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1nkh ... sp=sharing

I apologize for the confusion, and questionable actions I have done with the Discord Tournament.

Thanks for reading all of the above.
Ameya S. - Laurel Springs School (2017-)

TheScientists
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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by TheScientists » Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:37 pm

Due to time constraints - we will be using older, obscure packets for the WC and finals game in order to not cause further delay.
Due to this - we will not upload any packets publicly.
Thank you for understanding!
Ameya S. - Laurel Springs School (2017-)

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Re: 2019 NHBB Discord Tournament

Post by Banned Tiny Toon Adventures Episode » Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:01 pm

Image
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