HIGS Invitational

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HIGS Invitational

Postby higsquizbowl » Sun Jul 03, 2016 6:23 pm

Hello all,

HIGS Quiz Bowl will be writing a middle school/high school novice set. The set is written by players and coaches of HIGS, and the set is edited by coaches and other prominent high school/college players in the quiz bowl community. The main goal of this set is to expand the canon of middle school and introduce new concepts from the high school canon, so that middle school quiz bowl itself is more diverse. In terms of distribution, we want to appeal both to new middle school players as well as experienced ones.

Our set will have eleven preliminary rounds and one final round. All rounds will consist of 20/20 (tossups/bonuses) and a half-packet of 12/12 replacement questions.

Distribution
4/4 Literature
4/4 Science
4/4 History
2/2 Geography
1.5/1.5 Religion/Myth
0.5/0.5 Math
1/1 Music
1/1 Art
1/1 Trash
0.5/0.5 Current Events
0.5/0.5 Social Science/Philosophy

Fees
The mirror fee is $10 per team (including house teams); however, all fees from this tournament will be donated straight to Homeboy Industries, a program founded by Father Greg Boyle which “provides hope, training, and support to formerly gang-involved and previously incarcerated men and women allowing them to redirect their lives and become contributing members of our community.”

If you are interested in mirroring or have any questions, email us at higsquizbowl@gmail.com, or PM us.
*NOTE*: The date of the tournament's release as well as the distribution has been changed.
Last edited by higsquizbowl on Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby t-bar » Sun Jul 03, 2016 7:22 pm

higsquizbowl wrote:The set is written by players and coaches of HIGS, and the set is edited by coaches and other prominent high school/college players in the quiz bowl community.

Can you be more specific? Producing a high-quality set requires a lot of work that takes experience to do well. Most prospective customers would have a lot more faith in this product if they knew which writers and editors will be leading this process, and what experience they have.

higsquizbowl wrote:The main goal of this set is to expand the canon of middle school and introduce new concepts from the high school canon, so that middle school quiz bowl itself is more diverse.

I like the idea of creativity and fresh ideas at the middle school level, but I would strongly caution against the line of reasoning that "we should ask about this because it comes up at higher levels." While I don't have any experience writing middle school questions, I've seen this sort of thinking a lot with respect to the high school/college divide, and it usually leads to overly hard questions that reward reading college-level packets over any sort of knowledge that high schoolers are likely to have organically.

higsquizbowl wrote:HIGS

Finally, exactly what is this? I tried to find it on Google, and the only relevant results seem to be quizbowl and USABB stats.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby TylerV » Sun Jul 03, 2016 9:00 pm

higsquizbowl wrote:1.5/1.5 Math (1/1 Computation; 0.5/0.5 Math)


Can you elaborate on your decision to include comp math into the set? The only other place I have seen comp math in recent memory is certain NAQT sets and even then most of the tournaments I've staffed have instructed us to just skip them and go onto the next toss up.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby higsquizbowl » Sun Jul 03, 2016 9:32 pm

t-bar wrote:
higsquizbowl wrote:The set is written by players and coaches of HIGS, and the set is edited by coaches and other prominent high school/college players in the quiz bowl community.

Can you be more specific? Producing a high-quality set requires a lot of work that takes experience to do well. Most prospective customers would have a lot more faith in this product if they knew which writers and editors will be leading this process, and what experience they have.


Most of the writers are members of the team (either players or coaches). Our editors are mainly college players, as well as myself. Editors include Sui Feng Xu from UCI, Kevin Wang from Amherst (formerly went to Arcadia), William Scott from Homestead, and some of the alumni from Bellarmine who wrote the BELLOCO packet (Jarek and Jonchee). Although you don't often see middle-schoolers write questions often, remember that questions are thoroughly edited by all of us before being released. There is a 4-step editing system, making sure that at least 2 different editors look through a tossup or bonus before it is considered complete.

If you are looking to purchase the packet, I will update the forum post when we create a sample packet, so that you can observe the quality.

t-bar wrote:
higsquizbowl wrote:The main goal of this set is to expand the canon of middle school and introduce new concepts from the high school canon, so that middle school quiz bowl itself is more diverse.

I like the idea of creativity and fresh ideas at the middle school level, but I would strongly caution against the line of reasoning that "we should ask about this because it comes up at higher levels." While I don't have any experience writing middle school questions, I've seen this sort of thinking a lot with respect to the high school/college divide, and it usually leads to overly hard questions that reward reading college-level packets over any sort of knowledge that high schoolers are likely to have organically.


This is definitely an issue that we've looked at (and had to fix from our initial edits). Coaching middle school quiz bowl for three years myself, I've recognized what the MS canon is like, and in my opinion, many of the top MS players simply just memorize stock clues in the limited canon to get questions; there is no thorough studying. Expanding the length of the question, as well as what comes up for those questions will help to stop this trend.

t-bar wrote:
higsquizbowl wrote:HIGS

Finally, exactly what is this? I tried to find it on Google, and the only relevant results seem to be quiz bowl and USABB stats.


The team is originally named Challenger-Berryessa; however, we don't have any affiliation with the school (since we receive no aid from them), so we've decided to take a separate name.

Also, to answer TylerV's question, computation questions (and the high Geography distribution) are designed towards new middle school players, who will be able to answer these questions more easily (it also matches their curriculum more). Remember that the tournament has 21 bonuses and tossups, so you'll still have 20/20 if you choose to drop computation (with the replacements acting as the 21st tossup/bonus if needed).
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby TheDoctor » Sun Jul 03, 2016 10:48 pm

Hey neat. Hope your writing is going well, and I look forward to seeing the set once it's out.

higsquizbowl wrote:Also, to answer TylerV's question, computation questions (and the high Geography distribution) are designed towards new middle school players, who will be able to answer these questions more easily (it also matches their curriculum more). Remember that the tournament has 21 bonuses and tossups, so you'll still have 20/20 if you choose to drop computation (with the replacements acting as the 21st tossup/bonus if needed).


I understand why you think this, but it doesn't play out how you'd expect. SCOP Novice 6 had 88% conversion on math tossups (three points above the target conversion and topping most conversion rates outside of trash), and none of those are computational. In fact, I'd argue from my experiences playing in a time when such questions were common and coaching now that conversion on SCOP math is that high because none of the questions are computational. Comp questions are so different to hear and react to that they break up a game and either force coaches to put in a designated comp kid (who often will sit through most of the other questions with nothing to do) or force players to struggle to adjust out of "listening to clues" mode and into "listening to numbers" mode.

You really gain nothing by using comp questions, and non-comp definitely does not mean a decline in answer recognition, even among freshmen and new players, who make up the majority of SCOP's audience. If I were mirroring this, I would take advantage of the opportunity to replace comp questions without giving it a second thought, but I would strongly prefer to have designated MATH replacements instead of having to use randomized replacement questions and then not having those to work with.

Edit: Checked the MS version of SCOP 6 as well, out of curiosity, and the non-comp math got 91% conversion there, so this does hold for middle school.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby higsquizbowl » Mon Jul 04, 2016 12:09 am

TheDoctor wrote:Hey neat. Hope your writing is going well, and I look forward to seeing the set once it's out.

I understand why you think this, but it doesn't play out how you'd expect. SCOP Novice 6 had 88% conversion on math tossups (three points above the target conversion and topping most conversion rates outside of trash), and none of those are computational. In fact, I'd argue from my experiences playing in a time when such questions were common and coaching now that conversion on SCOP math is that high because none of the questions are computational. Comp questions are so different to hear and react to that they break up a game and either force coaches to put in a designated comp kid (who often will sit through most of the other questions with nothing to do) or force players to struggle to adjust out of "listening to clues" mode and into "listening to numbers" mode.

You really gain nothing by using comp questions, and non-comp definitely does not mean a decline in answer recognition, even among freshmen and new players, who make up the majority of SCOP's audience. If I were mirroring this, I would take advantage of the opportunity to replace comp questions without giving it a second thought, but I would strongly prefer to have designated MATH replacements instead of having to use randomized replacement questions and then not having those to work with.

Edit: Checked the MS version of SCOP 6 as well, out of curiosity, and the non-comp math got 91% conversion there, so this does hold for middle school.


Assuming we removed computation, where do you think the distribution should go? I feel that a 1.5 distribution on just Math is way too high with no computation is too high.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby TheDoctor » Mon Jul 04, 2016 12:27 am

Given that your distribution allows for 21-question rounds, I'd just kill that question per round and, instead of allowing the possibility that one of your listed lit, history, or science question might end up in the replacement slot, would leave the replacement undeclared and fill it with an additional one of those three core categories either randomly or on a rotation by round.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby higsquizbowl » Mon Jul 04, 2016 12:50 am

That sounds like a good idea. I'll talk about this with the other editors, but I think a focus on core subjects instead of computation is a right move.
Thanks for your help!
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby Irreligion in Bangladesh » Mon Jul 04, 2016 4:04 am

Whereas I'd keep the 1/1 math and slice off the 0.5 social science/philosophy, which usually doesn't go terribly well at middle school level. (Not that interesting social sciences clues can't find their way into geographical or historical questions.)
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby TheDoctor » Mon Jul 04, 2016 4:19 am

The comp takes up .5 math, so they'd still have 1/1 per round.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby TheDoctor » Mon Jul 04, 2016 4:20 am

I'd cut the other .5 per out of either trash or (this will be unpopular, but this category sucks for middle school content) lit.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby TheDoctor » Mon Jul 04, 2016 4:22 am

Or Geo. Just noticed the 2/2 on that.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby higsquizbowl » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:39 pm

Hello all,
In order to ensure that the quality of our tournament is optimal (since this is the first time we have written a tournament), we will be postponing the date of the tournament indefinitely. For those interested in how the tournament is going, we have finished writing 4/5 of the questions and have done preliminary edits for around 2/3 of the questions. Furthermore, I'm looking for someone to help me with editing the tournament; any experienced writers/editors for previous tournaments who will be dedicated to editing this packet, even during the school year, would be a great help. I'm willing to pay editors 5-10% of the total earnings (if you need more, I can personally work it out with you).

If you're interested in helping, please send me an email at higsquizbowl@gmail.com

Thanks!
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby higsquizbowl » Sun Jul 30, 2017 6:46 pm

Hello all,
After our staff has spent the last year and a half editing the set to the best of our abilities, I'm proud to announce that HIGS Invitational is ready to play and open for mirroring in the next quiz bowl season! The set features 12 full packets and a replacement packet of 6 tossups and 6 bonuses.

Distribution (updated) is as follows (tossups/bonuses):
History (4/4)
Literature (4/4)
Science (4/4)
Fine Arts (2/2)
Geography (2/2)
RMPSS (1.5/1.5)
Current Events (1/1)
Math (0.5/0.5)
Trash (1/1)

The mirror fee is still $10/team (including house teams); 90% of the money made from this tournament (10% going to editor discounts) will go to Homeboy Industries, a program founded by Father Greg Boyle which “provides hope, training, and support to formerly gang-involved and previously incarcerated men and women allowing them to redirect their lives and become contributing members of our community.”

A mirror of this tournament has between played at the CASE Tournament in Georgia, with 14 teams participating.

I'd like to give thanks to our editors, Kevin Wang and Eric Chen, as well as to many of my friends and co-writers, including Arushi Bansal, Devansh Bansal, Nathan Chan, Bryant Cong, and Anuj Kothari.

If you have any questions about the tournament and/or would like to mirror it in the upcoming season, please contact us at higsquizbowl@gmail.com.

Thanks!
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby higsquizbowl » Wed Aug 23, 2017 1:33 pm

I'd like to apologize for the typo, I accidentally wrote "the last hour and a half" when meaning to say "the last year and a half"; we've spent a good amount of time trying to perfect this set.
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Re: HIGS Invitational

Postby higsquizbowl » Sat Sep 23, 2017 2:03 am

Mirrors have been announced/finished in the following locations:
CASE (GA): May 6, 2017
Hoover High School (AL): Nov 4, 2017
Bay Area (CA): March/April; TBD
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