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Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 5:12 am
by TheDoctor
28 January 2012, there will be quiz bowl at Northern Illinois University. This year's Huskie Bowl will use the RM/TP/Bellarmine set for both the upper and lower divisions. Each division is capped at 12 teams.

Entry Fee: $65/team
Extra Team Discount: -$10/additional team from a school
Staffer Discount: -$10/experienced staffer
Buzzer Discount: -$5/working buzzer system

Register by e-mail at [email protected].

Upper
Auburn A
Auburn B
Belvidere North A
Carbondale
IMSA A
Loyola A
New Trier

Lower
Belvidere
Belvidere North B
Christian Life
Fenton
IMSA B
Keith Country Day A
Keith Country Day B
Lisle
Loyola B
Maine South A
Maine South B
Rolling Meadows
St. Viator A
St. Viator B
UIC College Prep
Westmont

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:34 am
by MLaudermith
Please put down Fenton for 1 team. We will bring a buzzer and I can staff.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 7:07 pm
by TheDoctor
For those who missed it, the field has been being all update-y in the initial post, and will continue to be so.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 7:11 pm
by Irreligion in Bangladesh
And we are still looking for staffing help; if you're interested in seeing some great teams play a great set and getting paid and fed to do so, send us an email!

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:38 pm
by mr_basque
Belvidere North would like 1 spot in each division.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 10:32 am
by mfastert
Belvidere would like one spot in the lower division.

Thanks,
Mike

User was reminded to add a signature. - Staff

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 3:13 pm
by Dominator
IMSA will be shorthanded for Huskie Bowl. IMSA A will actually be IMSA A-, IMSA B will actually be IMSA C+, and IMSA C is IMSA D. Feel free to move IMSA B down if you have the desire.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 3:14 pm
by AKKOLADE
The IMSA GPA is suffering.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 4:11 pm
by TheDoctor
As of today, 18 Jan, the field is closed. The initial post in this thread will be updated soon with a final field listing. If you very much wish to participate but have not yet registered, please contact me to be added to a waiting list in case of last minute cancellations.

If you are not registered, you wish to play, AND YOU CAN PROVIDE AN EXPERIENCED STAFFER, there is a slight (SLIGHT!) chance that we can expand the field. Let me know. [email protected]

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:33 pm
by Dominator
Assuming the field listing is current, IMSA B is going to do the tournament a favor and drop in order to eliminate bye rounds.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:38 pm
by Irreligion in Bangladesh
Dominator wrote:Assuming the field listing is current, IMSA B is going to do the tournament a favor and drop in order to eliminate bye rounds.
It's not. NO DONT

ETA: I'll let Kristin post the field, but I'm pretty sure we've got 24 right now.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:10 pm
by TheDoctor
Field in the initial post is currently correct, but is subject to change. I'll post a definitive field soon.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:28 pm
by TheDoctor
Updated field. There will still be some motion between the divisions in the next couple of days. The last team in the lower division will either be IMSA C or a hybrid team (or a later registration? Only time will tell).

Upper
Auburn A
Auburn B
Belvidere North A
Carbondale
IMSA A
Loyola A
New Trier

Lower
Belvidere
Belvidere North B
Christian Life
Fenton
IMSA B
THE GREAT UNKNOWN
Keith Country Day A
Keith Country Day B
Lisle
Loyola B
Maine South A
Maine South B
Rolling Meadows
St. Viator A
St. Viator B
UIC College Prep
Westmont

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:00 am
by Edward Elric
Maybe this is a dumb question, but why are you splitting the field into 2 divisions if you only have 7 teams in the upper and 24 teams overall? I feel like with a size that small, you should just have one field (4 Brackets of 6 in Prelims, etc.).

Note: As I am not attending this tournament, it's not my place to demand a specific format, but I have a genuine curiousity.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:19 am
by sssssssskkkk
I guess the Upper division could possibly run a double round robin + ACF finals for 12-14 rounds of play. Not sure how much people would like that idea or how well that would play out logistically, but it's a possibility. However, I don't exactly see how the lower division would run with 17 teams, a very awkward number. That being said, what WILL the format for this tournament be?

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:42 am
by dtaylor4
sssssssskkkk wrote:I guess the Upper division could possibly run a double round robin + ACF finals for 12-14 rounds of play. Not sure how much people would like that idea or how well that would play out logistically, but it's a possibility. However, I don't exactly see how the lower division would run with 17 teams, a very awkward number. That being said, what WILL the format for this tournament be?
With 17, you can scrounge up an 18th, or go 6-6-5 into playoff brackets of 6-6-5.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:05 pm
by Irreligion in Bangladesh
Edward Elric wrote:Maybe this is a dumb question, but why are you splitting the field into 2 divisions if you only have 7 teams in the upper and 24 teams overall? I feel like with a size that small, you should just have one field (4 Brackets of 6 in Prelims, etc.).

Note: As I am not attending this tournament, it's not my place to demand a specific format, but I have a genuine curiousity.
Excellent question! Before I start in on the answer, two quick notes. Attending or not attending, as members of the quizbowl community it is our place to give guidance and engage in conversation about all manner of tournaments. Second- you, Mike Perovanovic, should moderate this tournament because I have lost my voice. Please?

Anyway, 7 and 17 are horrible field numbers; those won't be the final field sizes. The first option is having an upper division of 6 and lower division of 18, which would require a team dropping from upper to lower - and we've emailed Coach Greene asking if Auburn B would be conducive to that. If that doesn't work, I imagine we'll then look at two options - bumping a team up from lower to upper to make 8 and 16, OR having one division. Given that the tourney was originally announced as two-divisions, I imagine that status quo will remain; changing it on Thursday night would be very annoying, I imagine, for many teams in both divisions.

All that said, we're gonna have a thousand different contingency schedules with us on Saturday morning :(

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:23 pm
by Edward Elric
Thanks for answering quickly. I figured it being 2 days before the tournament, changing it to one division wouldn't be the best idea. Sorry man, this is the only weekend i've had off this year and I need to prep for exams that I have next week. Good luck with the scheduling though, it'll work itself out in the end.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 5:07 pm
by TheDoctor
Current, still not final.

Upper
Auburn A
Auburn B
Belvidere North A
Carbondale
IMSA A
Loyola A
New Trier

Lower
Belvidere
Belvidere North B
Christian Life
Fenton
IMSA B
Keith Country Day
Lisle
Loyola B
Maine South A
Maine South B
Rolling Meadows
St. Viator A
St. Viator B
UIC College Prep
Westmont

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:58 pm
by Dominator
Bone seeker wrote:Anyway, 7 and 17 are horrible field numbers; those won't be the final field sizes. The first option is having an upper division of 6 and lower division of 18, which would require a team dropping from upper to lower - and we've emailed Coach Greene asking if Auburn B would be conducive to that.
Feel free to move IMSA B up if that makes things easier. I would really like this tournament to remain two brackets, and I'm prepared to give my B team the Jonah treatment if necessary.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:20 am
by TheDoctor
FIELD UPDATE: THIS TIME, IT'S PERSONAL (AND FINAL)

Upper
Auburn A
Belvidere North A
Carbondale
IMSA A
Loyola A
New Trier

Lower
Auburn B
Belvidere
Belvidere North B
Christian Life
Fenton
Hybrid (bring your extras, please)
IMSA B
IMSA C
Keith Country Day
Lisle
Loyola B
Maine South A
Maine South B
Rolling Meadows
St. Viator A
St. Viator B
UIC College Prep
Westmont

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:24 am
by Irreligion in Bangladesh
Given this field, we'll be doing a double round robin in Upper and 3 pools of 6, rebracketing into 3 pools of 6, in Lower. Upper will require 10 rounds plus potential ACF finals (though the probability of an advantaged final is much lower than usual due to the double RR), and Lower will run 9 rounds (the repeat match from the morning will be carried over and not replayed) plus potential ACF finals. We've got 12 packets.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 1:18 pm
by Irreligion in Bangladesh
Who has two thumbs and somehow found internet at DuSable Hall?

>this guy, who will be posting live stats shortly<

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 3:30 pm
by Irreligion in Bangladesh
Uber-Competitive, at lunch. We're through one RR with another RR to go. STATS

Standard, at lunch. We're rebracketing into 3 pools of 6. STATS

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 6:59 pm
by TheDoctor
We have posted all the stats.

Standard: Morning Playoffs Combined

Uber: STAAAATS

Congratulations to Fenton, who won the Standard Division in a two-game final with Auburn B, and to Loyola, who won the Uber-Competitive Division by default when we ran out of usable questions.

Edit: TEH GRAMMARZ

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:58 pm
by Guile Island
This tournament was well run, but I felt the set was disappointing. Random questions with no powermarks, a ton of repeats, and a flat out wrong answerline were the beggest issues. It can be fixed, but I feel this set needs some editing before it gets mirrored elsewhere.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 8:32 pm
by Charles Martel
The RM/TP/Bellarmine/Wikipedia set was atrocious, and I feel that there needs to be a private discussion group made so that I can post without spoiling answers a second time (the set already spoiled answers the first time when they re-used parts of bonuses and tossup answers repeatedly).

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 8:50 pm
by Jane Fairfax
I don't post much, but I feel it needs to be said that the quality of the set as presented was just awful. Thanks to NIU for hosting a well-run tournament, but the question set played like a very, very, very unpolished rough draft.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 8:50 pm
by jonah
whitesoxfan wrote:The RM/TP/Bellarmine/Wikipedia set was atrocious, and I feel that there needs to be a private discussion group made so that I can post without spoiling answers a second time (the set already spoiled answers the first time when they re-used parts of bonuses and tossup answers repeatedly).
And entire bonuses!

Atrocious is the right word. In no particular order, there were multiple instances each of questions not specifying what they were asking for, the exact same bonus appearing twice, major content repeats (both inter- and intra-packet), confusing or impossible-to-parse wording, clues that just didn't make any sense, missing powermarks, and probably other things that aren't coming to mind right now. It was draining and painful to read, and by all accounts looked painful to play too. In fact, we were not able to correctly resolve teams' final placement because we had to use some questions out of what was supposed to be a finals packet to deal with the several repeated bonuses issues.

I feel sorry for the teams who spent hundreds of dollars on entry fees, transportation, and in at least one case hotel rooms, only to get such a poor experience. This is in no way NIU's fault; they ran a tournament that was great in all facets except for the set.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:18 pm
by Charles Martel
One thing to note: IMSA A was missing a normal A team player (IMSA A-), and IMSA B lacked all of its normal B team players (IMSA C).

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:40 pm
by Dominator
jonah wrote:Atrocious is the right word. In no particular order, there were multiple instances each of questions not specifying what they were asking for, the exact same bonus appearing twice, major content repeats (both inter- and intra-packet), confusing or impossible-to-parse wording, clues that just didn't make any sense, missing powermarks, and probably other things that aren't coming to mind right now.
To beat a dead horse, punctuation was random, answer lines routinely did not give alternatives and underlined things as required not in accordance with quizbowl standards, and I actually had to end the second round of the advantaged final after Tossup 19 because both Tossup 20 and its replacement were repeats.

Congratulations to Loyola A, who did actually deserve to win today; the poor quality of the set should not overshadow that they played best today. Also congratulations to Fenton, whose win in the Standard division is their first tournament win ever (according to Mr. Laudermith); they also played great in both games of the finals and earned their victory.

The biggest positive of this tournament was the sportsmanship demonstrated. Abid's integrity and quick thinking on Tossup 20 actually allowed IMSA to power-thirty to tie Auburn, which IMSA won on tiebreaker. Also, Auburn B's Samantha notably corrected me when I had awarded her points thinking she garbled pronunciation of a foreign word when in actually she was saying a misspelled version of that word. Teams actually did sort of come together and bond over the terrible experience they were sharing.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:48 pm
by sssssssskkkk
The main problem, aside from all of the problems and criticisms listed by previous posters, was that there were no replacement bonuses and only twelve packets in this set! Because there were so many repeated answer lines and repeated bonuses (word-for-word the same as another one earlier in the set), we had to use bonuses from packets 11 and 12 (which were originally supposed to be used for finals), thus preventing us from having a legitimate tiebreaker+finals at this tournament. I certainly would have liked to play off against Auburn for a chance to play in a disadvantaged final against Loyola, but unfortunately the combination of repeats and lack of extra packets prevented us from doing so.

I would also like to thank Abid (again) for his display of sportsmanship in our Round 10 match against Auburn. Packet 10 had already deprived Auburn and IMSA each twice of sure powers by not containing power marks. Going into tossup 20, Auburn lead by 45, meaning we needed to power-30 to have a chance. Abid pointed out that it should be checked whether tossup 20 actually HAD a power-mark to begin with - it turns out it indeed lacked such a mark. After a power-marked replacement tossup in the finals packets was located, IMSA proceeded to power-30 and then power the overtime tossup to win. Had Abid and Auburn not been so sportsmanlike, it would have surely turned out differently.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:43 pm
by TheDoctor
Thanks, everyone, for attending this year's Huskie Bowl.

I would like to apologize to all of you for the quality of the questions. Though I'm sure many (if not all) of you are as incensed as I am over the myriad problems with these questions, I'd like to remind everyone not to publicly discuss specific topics until after their final mirror in mid-March.

Thank you for attending, and an extra helping of thanks to everyone who staffed and helped make the tournament as positive an experience as it could be. IN NO PARTICULAR ORDER (DRUMROLL): Tom DeMay, Greg Dzuricsko, Jonah Greenthal, Mathew Laird, Mike Laudermith, Danielle Long, Sharon Lorinskas, Ali Nagib, Neva O'Laughlin, Connie Prater, Noah Prince, Clark Reamer, David Reinstein, and Brad Fischer all contributed significantly to what I feel was, despite everything, a great bonding experience for all of us. Thank you all. You are wonderful.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:46 pm
by abnormal abdomen
Hey, as Diana Gerr said last year following TJ's incredible show of class at the NSC, being a good sport about things is a lot more important than winning a game. This does, of course, apply to most everyone who was at this tournament; IMSA and others who were in the running for the championship dealt with the situation with class and no one got terribly angry. Amazingly, I didn't see Brad attempt to destroy anything as a result of what he was dealing with. On that note, I'd like to thank Brad and the general collective of staffers at this tournament for being relatively patient and running the tournament as best as possible, given the unfortunate circumstances.

But yeah, aside from that, it shouldn't get lost in all this that Loyola indeed deserved to be named the victor at this tournament. They certainly outplayed the field as a whole. Congratulations to them.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 12:47 am
by nadph
I'd like to apologize to everyone at this tournament (as well as those who attended the Macomb mirror of it on 1/7) for the low quality of the set, and will endeavor to fix any and all mistakes found. I'd also like to publicly apologize to the Richard Montgomery and Torrey Pines writing teams for doing far less than my share of editing duties for this, which was the primary reason for much of the low quality. If you send observed mistakes, corrections, and general vitriol to nadesai [dot] bcp DELETEME [at] DELETEME gmail, I'll try to rectify them as soon as possible.

EDIT: Daniel Galitsky is going to post a more "official" statement/apology for this.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:20 am
by 1992 in spaceflight
I would like to ask that, once you guys have had time to edit the set, that it is submitted to an independent party to verify it. Because teams that are going to be playing this set and mirroring this set (such as my college team at Truman State) deserve better than what apparently happened at Northern Illinois. I am very worried about this, since many of the teams the Truman site would get do not need to be hearing repeats in both tossups and bonuses.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 7:55 am
by Deviant Insider
nadph wrote:EDIT: Daniel Galitsky is going to post a more "official" statement/apology for this.
I look forward to reading the statement and joining the private forum once it is created.

Re: Huskie Bowl at NIU 28 Jan 2012

Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 10:48 am
by Deviant Insider
Now that I have seen the appropriate Google Doc, I don't think that a private forum is necessary. Everybody can rest assured that the good people of Illinois are providing detailed feedback to the editors of this set. It is now up to the editors to take advantage of that feedback.