Illinois '08-'09

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Auks Ran Ova » Thu Dec 04, 2008 3:46 pm

David Riley wrote:As I said, do away with rebounds! A "bonus" by its nature goes to the team that "earned" the tossup.
I like the way you think.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Matt Weiner » Thu Dec 04, 2008 4:02 pm

There's good arguments both for and against bouncebacks, but if they are used, certainly one should look to how they are done in the places that have experimented with using them as part of an ACF/NAQT style bonus structure for years, to avoid making them more difficult than they need to be. For example, at the PACE NSC, which has always used bouncebacks and has always used the normal method of reading bonuses rather than the "all at once" Illinois thing, we certainly have no rule stating that the other team can't confer quietly while the first team is answering. We also have adopted the ACF rule that says the moderator may accept any answer clearly directed towards him, regardless of whether it comes from the captain; this eliminates the pointless "designating" procedure entirely.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) » Thu Dec 04, 2008 4:09 pm

I concur. If people in Illinois keep wanting to cite things like how Missouri does things, I feel it is fair to point out that even in the backwards nonsense that is Missouri, we use a bonus that is about the same format as Illinois but pull off rebounding like normal people without anyone ever complaining about "teamwork" not being present.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by cornfused » Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:45 pm

Ukonvasara wrote:
David Riley wrote:As I said, do away with rebounds! A "bonus" by its nature goes to the team that "earned" the tossup.
I like the way you think.
Hah. Nice, Rob.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by the return of AHAN » Thu Dec 04, 2008 6:11 pm

cornfused wrote:
Ukonvasara wrote:
David Riley wrote:As I said, do away with rebounds! A "bonus" by its nature goes to the team that "earned" the tossup.
I like the way you think.
Hah. Nice, Rob.
4 minutes after post 750? Anyone else smell a tempban coming?

Anyone else do the Great Auk yesterday? Not that it's great quizbowl. Nay, my 8th grade captain has pronounced it unhealthy for the team chemistry given the frantic shouting and arguing that occurs when people disagree on an answer. Nonetheless, it was a nice mental warm-up anyway, and we also get to see who among the new people might actually pan out when our official season begins next month.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by rjaguar3 » Thu Dec 04, 2008 8:16 pm

cornfused wrote:
rjaguar3 wrote:Quizbowl strongholds like Missouri
Gotta love that Florida format.
As I said at PAC 2008, only in Florida can you replace the 5-point round with a dice-rolling round and not affect the results of the national championship. :P
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by mlaird » Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:55 pm

Sectional Sites are up:
http://www.ihsa.org/activity/scb/2008-09/2site.htm
http://www.ihsa.org/activity/scb/2008-09/1site.htm

Also, in case your school missed the deadline, you can still enter if the late fee is paid:
http://www.ihsa.org/announce/2008-09/2008-11-05.htm

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by cornfused » Fri Dec 05, 2008 2:34 am

mlaird wrote:Also, in case your school missed the deadline, you can still enter if the late fee is paid:
http://www.ihsa.org/announce/2008-09/2008-11-05.htm
Hello, Illinois schobowl version of the rickroll.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by AKKOLADE » Fri Dec 05, 2008 7:54 am

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by David Riley » Fri Dec 05, 2008 11:37 am

Good luck to everyone playing in tomorrow's Decemberist! Any predictions?
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by BGSO » Fri Dec 05, 2008 12:50 pm

Nick's gonna love me for this but...

EDIT: Prediction Failure, I now reduce my post to the comment below.


That should be the playoff Bracket, our JV coach is taking us, so hopefully he'll realize how terrible MSL questions are. Especially at the JV level. I look forward to seeing everybody, and hopefully our Pop culture training tonight will pay off once again.
Last edited by BGSO on Sat Dec 06, 2008 12:56 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by David Riley » Fri Dec 05, 2008 1:09 pm

Who writes MSL's questions?
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by jonah » Fri Dec 05, 2008 1:27 pm

BGSO wrote:Nick's gonna love me for this but...

1. NT
2. Auburn
3. Loyola
4. BG
5. Lasalle-Peru
6. Loyola B


That should be the playoff Bracket, our JV coach is taking us, so hopefully he'll realize how terrible MSL questions are. Especially at the JV level. I look forward to seeing everybody and hopefully our Pop culture training tonight will pay off once again.
That's not going to be the playoff bracket, not least because New Trier isn't going.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by David Riley » Fri Dec 05, 2008 1:53 pm

Say what?!!? I thought they were coming...what happened?
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by jonah » Fri Dec 05, 2008 2:27 pm

Steve Server was busy, both Henrys were busy, Akhil had some conflict, and Ben decided he'd rather go biking with some friends. That leads to Shao playing solo which leads to never mind about going to that tournament.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Irreligion in Bangladesh » Fri Dec 05, 2008 2:52 pm

Also, I've been too busy to post a field update since then. Basically, sub in Sterling B and LaSalle Peru B for New Trier and Auburn E, and that's our field.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by BGSO » Fri Dec 05, 2008 3:16 pm

David Riley wrote:Who writes MSL's questions?
I know avery for Varsity and Bob Brown's The Question Well for JV in 07-08.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by BGSO » Sun Dec 07, 2008 1:17 am

Decemberist recap:

I'm gonna start off my post by thanking everyone that volunteered, played, and organized this tournament (Brad, cough cough). The moderators we were paired with were excellent (with a few exceptions), and playing on NAQT questions was a nice change from the usual crap we are forced to deal with.

In terms of things that I actually learned from today I was shocked at how bad some of these teams "Not from Chicago" really were. One match, the one toss-up the other team got was paired with a very simple basic American lit bonus (I can't mention specifics, Right?). While the pathetically tried to answer the bonus (zero'd) I was really taken back by how bad some of these teams really are. Now that we have these teams playing at tournaments with good (this is realtive) questions, how do we encourage them to seek the next level?

Next, Loyola is good, RA is great. Siva is dominant to say the least, with Michael adding, and Zahed pulling his weight in gold. They are as good as everyone thinks/predicted/knows and teams that have to play them should be scared at the very least. With due respect to Loyola, Jack and Joe completing each other’s bonus responses was pretty priceless, and I also thinks that it epitomizes the pairing that those two have become.

Back to the really bad teams (the half we watched before we could get our set was brutal). I have never realized how much a good or bad moderator can affect a match. The moderator that presided over the aforementioned match was terrible. Sure he had decent pronunciation but the way he spoke and delivered sucked the energy out of the room. Sure he was stuck between to less than spectacular teams. But upon entering the room our JV coach noticed the lack of energy immediately and we quickly deduced that the moderator was at fault.

In the bad match mentioned above I was also rather upset to learn that despite it being their 10th match with this particular set of rules both teams were oblivious to the neg rules. From what I gathered they believed that after FTP they were immune to negs and unless the rules were changed for the lowest two brackets then how were these teams still confused after 8 hours of quizbowl?

I think that's everything (I'll probably edit this a few times and add more crap) but I would once again like to thank Brad for putting on such an excellently run tournament, I'll especially enjoy my copy of Joseph Andrews/Shamela which should give me some incentive to study, Reading be fo fools.

David

RE-EDIT: I have gone to bed, yay sleep
RE-RE-edit: Got rid of names, though I kept the concept as to not change how terrible this post was, and added the intent of my post which I left out
Last edited by BGSO on Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Charley Pride » Sun Dec 07, 2008 2:21 am

I pretty much agree with David all around. Thanks to everyone for braving the cold and snow to come all the way out to good old Rockford, and much credit to Brad, Kristen (Kristin?), and all the tournament staff and volunteers. For the most part, moderators were superb, and the slower moderators' effect was minimalized by the likes of Brad, BJ, Mr. Laird, and Mr. Laudermith (to name a few). The field wasn't actually terrible; it's just that the bad teams were awful, but the fact that they came out says something. Props to everyone who qualified for the upper bracket (Loyola A, Loyola B, Buffalo Grove, Byron, Auburn A, Auburn C). I hope everyone had a good time.

I appreciate the praise, David, though I don't know about the gold....I really like a lot of what I see in Illinois scholastic bowl right now. Of course, there're tons of problems still, but there are to things I want to point out.

1. Buffalo Grove (et al.) and their dedication to improving. In a state where any program with a solid level of dedication will take to you the top, BG is doing all of the right things. Hopefully the incoming seniors will keep it up after Nick and David leave, and hopefully their coach continues to realize he has some special players on his team.

2. A growing youth movement. I can speak for Auburn and even Loyola when I emphasize the importance of building from the ground up. That's why I love the idea of bringing along as many auxiliary teams as possible. Both teams basically started bringing everyone who's available that Saturday, and I already see signs of improvement. Playing on a higher level, even as a freshman, will help create that desire to get better and strive to rise to the top. I haven't seen any Loyola or Auburn underclassmen hang their heads after a blowout to a stronger team, and that's how it needs to be. Getting kicked around a little bit should only light a fire under teams, pushing them to work ever harder. I hope other teams follow that model as more players and coaches take deeper interest.


Can't wait for Davey and Goliath....
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Irreligion in Bangladesh » Sun Dec 07, 2008 3:17 am

General results - Auburn A, Loyola A, Buffalo Grove, were 1-2-3. The other 3 top playoff teams were (in no particular order, because I don't have the stats on me) Loyola B, Auburn C, and Byron. In the top consolation bracket, Winnebago, Boylan, and Auburn B went 1-2-3. Richmond Burton went undefeated in consolation bracket #2. Full stats will be up at some point relatively soon bordering on Monday. They probably would have been done tonight, except my body completely gave out on me after we'd left :) Little sleep + no chair for moderating + running everywhere = bad, to no surprise. Then I fell asleep before posting this, so here I am.

Siva put up something like 115 ppg for top scorer honors, and was also neg champion (earning himself a copy of The Secret Life of :bees: )

Full stats will be up sometime soon, along with a general recap, as soon as my mind returns to normal. A few quick notes that I've got in my head --

1. Any feedback about any moderator - good or bad, preferably both - would be greatly appreciated. I can reference the schedule, so if all you remember is "it was the match against so-and-so" or "it was round X" or "the guy with the hair," I can pretty much deduce who it was and put the feedback to the appropriate person. It all helps, so send it my way. styxman42 AT gmail DOT com.

2. So the playoff pools were based on points per bonus, right? (With a little alteration between the bottom two consolations to prevent some extra repeat matches) Basically, if my memory serves from creating the playoff pools, Auburn A and Loyola topped 20 ppb, BG was somewhere around 18, Loyola B was around there as well, Auburn C and Byron were at 14ish. The consolation pool featured ppb between 11 and 12. The second consolation pool had only one team topping 10 ppb. Something like 8 teams did not top 7 ppb in the morning. So there's a nugget of stats to hold you over until stats are up.

Thank you all for coming, and for the compliments. I'd say see you next year, but the tourney's not over until stats are up :)
Brad Fischer
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Northern Illinois University ('10)
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Kanga-Rat Murder Society » Sun Dec 07, 2008 1:47 pm

These are going to sound repeteitive after Garb's comments, but I need to make a few notes:

1. This tournament basically confirmed what I already knew. Rockford Auburn and Loyola were vastly superior to us, proving that the big four are not going to be caught by us (or probably anyone else) anytime soon. Also, the rest of the state is as bad as advertised. Without going into specifics, I saw numerous easy toss-ups go dead (and by easy, I mean naming the authors of common works). If I did not neg, we would have shut out a team in the morning. That same team wound up winning two games in our bracket. Even Class A powerhouse Byron seemed hopeless going against us, as we were shutting them out at halftime. This would not have been the case last year.

2. Yes, the field was weak. That said, this is the type of tournament that needs to happen. It was a well run tournament where every team besides Auburn, Loyola, and us got to play several teams that were as good as them. If we want quizbowl in Illinois to continue we need to expose these teams to quizbowl questions in a way that will not intimidate them. I believed that Decemberist achieved this very well and everybody went away happy.

3. Brad, I am positive that we did not get 18 PPB in the morning. We were probably somewhere around 14 PPB. Our World History person came late due to SAT Subject Tests while our science person did not come up. Our other starter for five player Scholastic Bowl was at a debate tournament. That basically left Garb and I. Due to this, we got 0 or 10 on every Science and World History, which seemed to be every bonus that we got. We may have averaged 18 PPB in the afternoon as Alex, our World History person showed up and we got more bonuses on our specialties (Lit, Geography, Current Events, etc.). Also, I think that the four division champions automatically advanced on along with two wild cards determined by PPB.
BGSO wrote: Back to the really bad teams (the half we watched before we could get our set was brutal). I have never realized how much a good or bad moderator can affect a match. The moderator that presided over the aforementioned match was terrible. Sure he had decent pronunciation but the way he spoke and delivered sucked the energy out of the room. Sure he was stuck between to less than spectacular teams. But upon entering the room our JV coach noticed the lack of energy immediately and we quickly deduced that the moderator was at fault.

In the bad match mentioned above I was also rather upset to learn that despite it being their 10th match with this particular set of rules both teams were oblivious to the neg rules. From what I gathered they believed that after FTP they were immune to negs and unless the rules were changed for the lowest two brackets then how were these teams still confused after 8 hours of quizbowl?
Actually, the moderator ruled it a neg. One of the coaches must have thought that the neg rule expired at the end of the power. He stated this and the moderator, not wanting a confrontation in the final game of the game, ruled it as a non-neg. To his credit, when a similar sitiuation occured later and the other team negged, he ruled it as a non-neg. This was the biggest error I saw a moderator make all day. My only other complaint was that our first scorekeeper did not know how to score.

Thank you to Brad, Kristen, and RVC for running this. We appreciated your patience as we tried to get into our school to take us to this, and we had a great time.
Nicholas Bergeon
Buffalo Grove High School '09
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by jakestouffer » Sun Dec 07, 2008 4:24 pm

Hey, all!

A few things to post on here, then I will hang up and listen to your comments ;)

1) First and foremost, as the coach of a team that is just starting to come out of our "conference-only" schedule again and make appearances at tournaments, I would like to restate that Brad, Kristin, and the entire group at RVC put on a bang-up show yesterday! There were all kinds of things that can/will/do go wrong, but these folks handled all of them with eagerness and class. Great job!!

2) This one is in regard to the "bad team" comments. Quite frankly, we are not very good at all at this format. I think our highest score all day was in the mid-200's and we ended up finishing ahead of Auburn's "D" team by 20 points in the 3rd pool final. In defense of teams like my fellow Big Northern Conference brethren, we play in a very slow-paced conference/IHSA format and the faster NAQT format is very new to us. These teams sometimes genuinely struggle to get kids out for something like this. Our score against Loyola "A" :shock: was 465 - 10. TEN! (Although, we WERE leading 0 to -5 after the first question. HUGE boost to us! :lol: ). My point is that you can judge us harshly for trying and ultimately being NO match for your teams, or you can help the continued efforts to build quiz bowl in Illinois. This effort has begun with the top teams and there are certainly "teams on the rise." However, I know that here at RB there are state championship WYSE and Math teams. It is in the Scholastic Bowl area that we are trying to catch up to the pack. To see comments like the ones that are posted on this site light a fire under MY butt, but you need to do a little soul searching before you judge other programs that you have no idea about. (This is me making no friends. :wink: )

Well, thank you again for everything this weekend, and I can't wait to see stats so that we can continue to improve!! Take care, all!

Jake Stouffer
Academic Team Coach
Richmond-Burton HS
(Not Richmond-Bunton, not Richard-Burton) :grin:
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by the return of AHAN » Sun Dec 07, 2008 5:20 pm

Aub-ZH wrote:Can't wait for Davey and Goliath....
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by BGSO » Sun Dec 07, 2008 5:36 pm

jakestouffer wrote:Hey, all!

A few things to post on here, then I will hang up and listen to your comments ;)

1) First and foremost, as the coach of a team that is just starting to come out of our "conference-only" schedule again and make appearances at tournaments, I would like to restate that Brad, Kristin, and the entire group at RVC put on a bang-up show yesterday! There were all kinds of things that can/will/do go wrong, but these folks handled all of them with eagerness and class. Great job!!

2) This one is in regard to the "bad team" comments. Quite frankly, we are not very good at all at this format. I think our highest score all day was in the mid-200's and we ended up finishing ahead of Auburn's "D" team by 20 points in the 3rd pool final. In defense of teams like my fellow Big Northern Conference brethren, we play in a very slow-paced conference/IHSA format and the faster NAQT format is very new to us. These teams sometimes genuinely struggle to get kids out for something like this. Our score against Loyola "A" :shock: was 465 - 10. TEN! (Although, we WERE leading 0 to -5 after the first question. HUGE boost to us! :lol: ). My point is that you can judge us harshly for trying and ultimately being NO match for your teams, or you can help the continued efforts to build quiz bowl in Illinois. This effort has begun with the top teams and there are certainly "teams on the rise." However, I know that here at RB there are state championship WYSE and Math teams. It is in the Scholastic Bowl area that we are trying to catch up to the pack. To see comments like the ones that are posted on this site light a fire under MY butt, but you need to do a little soul searching before you judge other programs that you have no idea about. (This is me making no friends. :wink: )

Well, thank you again for everything this weekend, and I can't wait to see stats so that we can continue to improve!! Take care, all!

Jake Stouffer
Academic Team Coach
Richmond-Burton HS
(Not Richmond-Bunton, not Richard-Burton) :grin:
You are right, we are making judgments about your teams based on your stats and what we know about you (as little as that is). However, on that note the fact that you are here and reading all the things we have to say about your part of the state will only make you better. We have been arguing/discussing how to make teams like yours better and attending the Decemberist was the first task. Now it is your job to make your team better, there are resources all over the place that will help you score 50, 100, 150 points against Loyola. I'm not going to go into a "How to make your program better" spiel, so many people have already done that; However, I will once again reiterate to you that you should read everything you can, troll like no one before you, ask questions that you may have, and overall realize that we are all really small Illinoisans in a really big pond of quizbowl.

David
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Buffalo Grove High School '09
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Auroni » Sun Dec 07, 2008 5:39 pm

BGSO wrote:In terms of things that I actually learned from today I was shocked at how bad some of these teams "Not from Chicago" really were. When we played North Boone, the one toss-up they got got was paired with a very simple basic American lit bonus (I can't mention specifics, Right?). While the pathetically tried to answer the bonus (zero'd) I was really taken back by how bad some of these teams really are. I mean, we all know they are bad, but that bad?

Back to the really bad teams (the half we watched before we could get our set was brutal). I have never realized how much a good or bad moderator can affect a match. The moderator that presided over the aforementioned match was terrible. Sure he had decent pronunciation but the way he spoke and delivered sucked the energy out of the room. Sure he was stuck between to less than spectacular teams. But upon entering the room our JV coach noticed the lack of energy immediately and we quickly deduced that the moderator was at fault.
what a dick thing of you to say.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) » Sun Dec 07, 2008 5:50 pm

2) This one is in regard to the "bad team" comments. Quite frankly, we are not very good at all at this format. I think our highest score all day was in the mid-200's and we ended up finishing ahead of Auburn's "D" team by 20 points in the 3rd pool final. In defense of teams like my fellow Big Northern Conference brethren, we play in a very slow-paced conference/IHSA format and the faster NAQT format is very new to us. These teams sometimes genuinely struggle to get kids out for something like this. Our score against Loyola "A" :shock: was 465 - 10. TEN! (Although, we WERE leading 0 to -5 after the first question. HUGE boost to us! :lol: ). My point is that you can judge us harshly for trying and ultimately being NO match for your teams, or you can help the continued efforts to build quiz bowl in Illinois. This effort has begun with the top teams and there are certainly "teams on the rise." However, I know that here at RB there are state championship WYSE and Math teams. It is in the Scholastic Bowl area that we are trying to catch up to the pack. To see comments like the ones that are posted on this site light a fire under MY butt, but you need to do a little soul searching before you judge other programs that you have no idea about. (This is me making no friends. :wink: )
Actually, I think with this post you've made a good number of friends. It really is encouraging to hear that you are interested in increasing the sphere of your club's attendance and are interested in improving. This board is a great place to learn things about quizbowl, and there are lots of us here who are able and willing to show you what you need to do to become a competitive team.
Also, I fully agree about the teams making judgment calls. Frankly, when I read your comments, David, about the non-Loyola or Auburn teams being bad I was kind of appalled. We need to be encouraging new programs to come out of the woodwork and show up to good events so that they can get better, and as part of this there are going to be teams that show up to tournaments who aren't that good. These teams need to be encouraged to keep this up, and people being obnoxious about the fact they weren't playing very well is going to do nothing to change that. There is a difference between people who care about quizbowl complaining about poorly run tournaments and poorly written questions, because those are things that should be done better, and teams that are not good but are starting to support good tournaments and are interested in making that shift don't deserve the same treatment. Complaining about teams being bad really strikes me as an awful, selfish thing to do, and I am especially baffled at where you get off doing it because I'm sure at some point your team was not as good as they are at the moment, and as every team knows there is still more work to do to become the best team you can be. So please, stop spouting off from your standpoint of some kind of self-given "superiority" to look down on the filthy masses and start actually making the posts that need to be made and doing what you can to improve the state of quizbowl.
Charlie Dees, North Kansas City HS '08
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by BGSO » Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:05 pm

Charlie in defense of my post, the comments I made me be in bad though they are none the less true. I have always thought of the board, this thread in particular as a place to state things I/others have seen and then using the general community as a way of diagnosing and proposing solutions to the problem. The post I made as a recap was observations of what I have seen. We are trying to make a whole state better as a whole, the main reason that I made those comments about North Boone is that looking back, it was not the team that made me see them as a joke but rather the general attitude of their coach, who during the whole match seemed annoyed to have taken her team to the tournament. Our moderator was BJ who I thought was excellent, though this coach seemed to try to blame everything about her team’s shortcomings on things like the questions and the moderator. This is the main issue we are dealing with, and I think that the more insight we can get into teams like these the better.

David
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) » Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:16 pm

Dude, that is so totally not the way to go about it that I don't even want to believe you are actually going back and justifying your dumb comments from before.
Charlie Dees, North Kansas City HS '08
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Charley Pride » Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:24 pm

Jeremy Gibbs Free Energy wrote:
2) This one is in regard to the "bad team" comments. Quite frankly, we are not very good at all at this format. I think our highest score all day was in the mid-200's and we ended up finishing ahead of Auburn's "D" team by 20 points in the 3rd pool final. In defense of teams like my fellow Big Northern Conference brethren, we play in a very slow-paced conference/IHSA format and the faster NAQT format is very new to us. These teams sometimes genuinely struggle to get kids out for something like this. Our score against Loyola "A" :shock: was 465 - 10. TEN! (Although, we WERE leading 0 to -5 after the first question. HUGE boost to us! :lol: ). My point is that you can judge us harshly for trying and ultimately being NO match for your teams, or you can help the continued efforts to build quiz bowl in Illinois. This effort has begun with the top teams and there are certainly "teams on the rise." However, I know that here at RB there are state championship WYSE and Math teams. It is in the Scholastic Bowl area that we are trying to catch up to the pack. To see comments like the ones that are posted on this site light a fire under MY butt, but you need to do a little soul searching before you judge other programs that you have no idea about. (This is me making no friends. :wink: )
Actually, I think with this post you've made a good number of friends. It really is encouraging to hear that you are interested in increasing the sphere of your club's attendance and are interested in improving. This board is a great place to learn things about quizbowl, and there are lots of us here who are able and willing to show you what you need to do to become a competitive team.
Also, I fully agree about the teams making judgment calls. Frankly, when I read your comments, David, about the non-Loyola or Auburn teams being bad I was kind of appalled. We need to be encouraging new programs to come out of the woodwork and show up to good events so that they can get better, and as part of this there are going to be teams that show up to tournaments who aren't that good. These teams need to be encouraged to keep this up, and people being obnoxious about the fact they weren't playing very well is going to do nothing to change that. There is a difference between people who care about quizbowl complaining about poorly run tournaments and poorly written questions, because those are things that should be done better, and teams that are not good but are starting to support good tournaments and are interested in making that shift don't deserve the same treatment. Complaining about teams being bad really strikes me as an awful, selfish thing to do, and I am especially baffled at where you get off doing it because I'm sure at some point your team was not as good as they are at the moment, and as every team knows there is still more work to do to become the best team you can be. So please, stop spouting off from your standpoint of some kind of self-given "superiority" to look down on the filthy masses and start actually making the posts that need to be made and doing what you can to improve the state of quizbowl.

This is another great example of what I want to see. As a member of one of the top teams in the state, I don't want to have to rely on 3 or 4 teams to provide real matches for us. So when I comment on teams' lack of production, I'm lamenting the fact that they're wasting a great amount of potential. As in this case, there's a school that has a solid crop of really intelligent students. All that's needed is a dedicated coach (which I see here) and dedicated players. I think the weaker teams should continue to take the opportunity to play at tournaments with tougher competition, because pairing the big losses with a helpful coach creates more encouragement than discouragement. Imagine team XYZ, a team with a lot of smart kids but is one that just started out in the quizbowl universe. They just blown out by a Loyola or New Trier or Carbondale squad. But because of a certain amount of positive reinforcement, they translate that blowout into more desire. Once teams begin to appreciate what it takes, they can grow. At the same time, teams at the top need cut down on the arrogance (I include myself here) and refrain from insulting or dismissive behavior.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Kanga-Rat Murder Society » Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:28 pm

jakestouffer wrote:Hey, all!

A few things to post on here, then I will hang up and listen to your comments ;)

1) First and foremost, as the coach of a team that is just starting to come out of our "conference-only" schedule again and make appearances at tournaments, I would like to restate that Brad, Kristin, and the entire group at RVC put on a bang-up show yesterday! There were all kinds of things that can/will/do go wrong, but these folks handled all of them with eagerness and class. Great job!!

2) This one is in regard to the "bad team" comments. Quite frankly, we are not very good at all at this format. I think our highest score all day was in the mid-200's and we ended up finishing ahead of Auburn's "D" team by 20 points in the 3rd pool final. In defense of teams like my fellow Big Northern Conference brethren, we play in a very slow-paced conference/IHSA format and the faster NAQT format is very new to us. These teams sometimes genuinely struggle to get kids out for something like this. Our score against Loyola "A" :shock: was 465 - 10. TEN! (Although, we WERE leading 0 to -5 after the first question. HUGE boost to us! :lol: ). My point is that you can judge us harshly for trying and ultimately being NO match for your teams, or you can help the continued efforts to build quiz bowl in Illinois. This effort has begun with the top teams and there are certainly "teams on the rise." However, I know that here at RB there are state championship WYSE and Math teams. It is in the Scholastic Bowl area that we are trying to catch up to the pack. To see comments like the ones that are posted on this site light a fire under MY butt, but you need to do a little soul searching before you judge other programs that you have no idea about. (This is me making no friends. :wink: )

Well, thank you again for everything this weekend, and I can't wait to see stats so that we can continue to improve!! Take care, all!

Jake Stouffer
Academic Team Coach
Richmond-Burton HS
(Not Richmond-Bunton, not Richard-Burton) :grin:
I understand what you are saying and I respect you for saying it. We were not thrust into a good program. My freshman year, our captain told us flat out that he did not bother to study because they would never beat Fremd. Our team practiced one hour per week on MSL Questions. We decided to do something about it: We organized team study sessions every Friday Night, went to ACE camp, and read questions on David's iTouch every chance we have. Even now, we spent months trying to find somebody to take us to Decemberist. We have done the work and BG is no longer a bad team. I know that if your team works hard, you can become as good as we are now (probably better).

The good news is that you clearly want to win and that you are willing to get your kids to work hard. The fact that you were willing to post shows that you are already more competent than our coach. There is no doubt in my mind that if you can get your team to work hard, your team can become a good team. I wish you luck in that. In fact, I would suggest that you apply for a grant to send your players to ACE camp. This is the fastest way to help your team improve and it is currently attended by Loyola, Auburn, and Carbondale.

Also, you are not the only program that is not used to this format. For the record, this was BG's first ever NAQT tournament. It is an awkward transition, but one that is well worth making. If your conference questions are as bad as ours, you know exactly what I am talking about.

Your comments indicate that you think that BG is a powerhouse with a lot of experience. We are not. I was once in your shoes. It is a long journey to the top (or at least near the top), but one that is well worth taking. Good luck and hopefully before too long your Math Team will be trying to catch up to you.

Once again, I am sorry about the unedited post :oops: . I hope to personally apologize to you at New Trier and thank you for not being as much of a "tool" as I was.

Edited to get rid of the doucheness
Last edited by Kanga-Rat Murder Society on Mon Dec 08, 2008 8:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by JackGlerum » Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:38 pm

David and Nick, I like your team, but both of you are coming off as huge tools in these last few posts.

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Charley Pride » Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:43 pm

I feel that.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by jonah » Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:52 pm

JackGlerum wrote:both of you are coming off as huge tools in these last few posts.
this
Aub-ZH wrote:I feel that.
ITT Zahed feels huge tools.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Charley Pride » Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:55 pm

jonah wrote:
JackGlerum wrote:both of you are coming off as huge tools in these last few posts.
this
Aub-ZH wrote:I feel that.
ITT Zahed feels huge tools.
Well played, Jonah. Well played. Though wouldn't I have to have said ''I feel those''?
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Siverus Snape » Sun Dec 07, 2008 7:50 pm

BG MSL Champs wrote: Therefore, when I call a team a "bad team", I am not saying that you are a dumb bunch of people, you are a bad program, and everybody from Richmond is inadequate. What I am saying is that, at this moment, you have not done the work to be considered anything other than a bad team in the context of this forum. If this is elitist, then so be it.
...
Also, you are not the only program that is not used to this format. For the record, this was BG's first ever NAQT tournament.
...
In conclusion, your own post does exactly what you say we sould not do. Your comments indicate that you think that BG is a powerhouse with a lot of experience. We are not. I was once in your shoes. The difference is that I did not get got angry. I got even. Hopefully, you can help guide your team to do the same.
So....basically, you're trying to say that we should all pat you guys on the back for starting from the bottom and being "okay" AND that you're now good enough to make imperious proclamations about the inadequacy of the students of an entire program? Where do you get off accusing the R-B coach of getting "angry" where you merely got "even"? Did you honestly think, "Gee, this team didn't know a lot of basic quiz bowl stuff and consequently didn't score many points; I bet they're not capable of figuring that out themselves, so I will proceed to let them know that my team (which I admit isn't close to beating the best teams in the state) thinks that they are very, very bad and should have given us more of a challenge"?

I do commend you and your team for your dedication to getting better, but it doesn't seem like you guys have picked up the concepts of humility and respect that one would expect from a team that apparently pulled itself up by its bootstraps. Making repeated remarks about the inability of inexperienced teams to answer questions is by no means appropriate, and I'd really appreciate it if you would knock it off and stop trying to defend your false sense of superiority.
Siva Sundaram, Rockford Auburn High School '09

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) » Sun Dec 07, 2008 8:01 pm

You took the words out of my mouth. I really can't believe your posts, Buffalo Grove people.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by closesesame » Sun Dec 07, 2008 8:02 pm

To the Buffalo Grove kid: Come play in the DC area :lol:

Seriously, though, quizbowl has only recently started moving from quick recall formats to the longer, academic formats promoted by house-written tournaments, HSAPQ, and mACF events. Some regions, like the DC area and the East Coast in general, seem to have gotten a head start, but our duty is to promote good quizbowl so we can have a relatively even playing field and get on with the game. Do you seriously think that mocking other teams will make them want to do good quizbowl? If teams at speed tournaments are nicer to them than teams at academic tournaments, will they want to do academic tournaments? Obviously not. Dude, don't make them think we're all jerks like you.

Oh, and if you think NAQT is the paragon of academic quizbowl, boy are you wrong...
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by BGSO » Sun Dec 07, 2008 8:59 pm

This may be the death of me, and the last thing I post for a while but...
zahed wrote: PAGE 12!!!!!!!

It's pretty clear based on even the most recent results that Illinois scholastic bowl is Chicagoland v. Auburn v. another entity (right now it's Carbondale). Sadly, there's not a whole lot of evidence to refute that. So the word 'inferior', while harsh and even disrespectful, may be the most appropriate.
styxman wrote:
Highlights from the stats:
*The average points per game in the prelims for all teams was under 120. Playoff teams only: 160 points per game. Non playoff teams - 96 points per game.
*The top seed by points, Moline, put up 940 points (188 PPG) in a pool featuring 4 of the 6 worst teams in the tournament by points. No team hit 200 PPG for the tournament.
*In fact, only 12 times in the entire tournament did a team score more than 200 points.
*Only once in 73 total games did a team top 300 points (LaSalle Peru, 310 in round 2). After the 310, the next highest score was 220 points.
*The top bonus conversion in the playoff matches was around 11.
Again, full stats will be up tomorrow.

It's more than just low numbers, however. The general level of play will be generously referred to as mediocre. In my rooms alone, I witnessed the following incredibly easy tossups go dead -- Avogadro's Number (given the number), the American Revolutionary War (given Saratoga), Euler (given namesake of e), Lavoisier, Thomas Hardy (given Jude and Tess), Our Town, period of a sine function (in one of the semifinals, no less). When teams were getting tossups, it was always on the giveaway clues - out of 144 tossups read, I saw no more than 3 tossups answered within the first 60% of the tossup, and a poll of moderators at lunch told of similar results. While there were some questions that were, in my opinion, probably too hard for Kickoff (heck, I wrote a couple of them myself, especially in music), they amounted to no more than 1 or 2 per round. Teams were struggling to answer 12 out of 18 questions per match; the ten-member all tournament team ranged from 46 ppg to 24 ppg.

I could continue with horror stories of questions, but that's not what has me disturbed by the results of this tournament. Numerous coaches came to me and expressed their dislike of the questions in a manner that was absolutely disheartening. Every coach that spoke of the questions noted that the answers were too obscure and that the tossups were too long. What's more, they agreed to the general concept that these questions were "good for the Auburns/New Triers/Loyolas, but not good for them," that they don't care what NAQT does, or what Team Illinois does, or what the rest of the nation does. They consistently accused the top tier schools as elitist and removed from the "real world." They overwhelmingly saw tossups that no one knew even by the giveaway, and lines and lines of extra clues that were therefore useless. Cheryl Christianson admitted that she was considering boycotting the use of Aegis for next year's Kickoff without serious changes, including dropping question length by "at least 3 lines." Most of these coaches are absolutely ignorant of the basic concepts of good quizbowl, and it's coming to a boil. This has got to be addressed, and I'm hoping it starts tomorrow.
JackGlerum wrote:My biggest complaint for Aegis was the easiness, though it's hard to make it appropriate for all levels when the other three (inferior) regions are playing on the same questions.
leapfrog314 wrote: BUT, and here's my point -- if high-school coaches are complaining that we are being elitist by foisting on them questions about Avogadro's number, the American Revolution, and Our Town, I don't know how to respond. Quizbowl is an activity designed for people who know stuff, or at least like to know stuff. If you like to know stuff but don't: read some books, go to ACE, read old packets. If you don't know stuff and you are outraged that we're writing questions about (gasp) academic subjects, I don't know how to help.
cornfused wrote:
gack1224 wrote:
JackGlerum wrote:My biggest complaint for Aegis was the easiness, though it's hard to make it appropriate for all levels when the other three (inferior) regions are playing on the same questions.
While the "inferiority" to Chicagoland may be true in some ways, you don't have to be arrogant about it.
That's not arrogant. It has been statistically proven - on this page of this thread, even - that the other three regions are inferior to Chicagoland at quizbowl. If you're inferring that he meant inferior in some arena/way other than quizbowl, that's your thought, not his.
All of the sudden now we are elitist and arrogant? :w-hat:
David Garb-
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(11:23:30 PM) garb: Wait, are you talking about the porn or the reeses?

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Mechanical Beasts » Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:08 pm

BGSO wrote:All of the sudden now we are elitist and arrogant? :w-hat:
I will admit to knowing little about the politics of Illinois quizbowl, but what strikes me is that while the context in which those quotes were found was largely constructive (or at least focused on ensuring that questions continue to be written so that everyone can learn from them, and ensuring that the questions be made no worse in trying to make them more answerable, if that's a problem). Yours just described, like "people really blow! here's a little story about a team that sucked." That's not even pornographic; it's not exciting enough.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by jakestouffer » Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:11 pm

Hey, all-

I didn't mean to get everybody so fired up. Honest and truly I didn't.

I appreciate both sides of this argument, and to everyone from BG, you guys are good! We aspire to be there. We aspire to the level of Auburn and Loyola and New Trier. We would love to have the dedication of the out of state groups. Heck, in our own conference there are 3 or 4 teams that, if we were emulating them, we would be doing alright!

But, I just ask that you don't lump everyone into "good" and "bad." There are so many more levels to a good academic team than just being victorious. Being the first team up and shaking hands, being gracious in defeat and humble in victory, these are the things that we try and do. The study sessions, extra work, and individual commitment to a team effort will come for us. I just know that no one but the folks at any particular school know exactly what is going on there. Just be proud of what YOU have done, work on YOUR efforts, and maintain YOUR program. If I thought we were ANY better than some of the programs that we went up against and handily defeated at a tournament, then I would be sadly mistaken. Some people from the outside might look at some of our scores and say that we did ok this weekend, but my kids and I all feel like there is more work to be done.

And I would really like to make my team better. They would like to be better. As we go to more events, we will develop better strategies. I know that it won't be fast enough for my team OR its coach, but it will happen. Thank you to those on this board that would encourage that. You should be commended for your maturity and insight. Thank you also to those who will give me advice and criticism in a HEALTHY way. It is very easy to look down on people that are not as good at something as you are. I am very glad that there are those willing to look down, lend a hand, and help us along. Best luck going forward to ALL schools! (Especially if you happen to play Auburn! You guys are awesome! :smile: )

Thank you again for allowing the old dude to ramble-

Jake Stouffer
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Richmond-Burton High School
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Kanga-Rat Murder Society » Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:11 pm

Siverus Snape wrote:
BG MSL Champs wrote: Therefore, when I call a team a "bad team", I am not saying that you are a dumb bunch of people, you are a bad program, and everybody from Richmond is inadequate. What I am saying is that, at this moment, you have not done the work to be considered anything other than a bad team in the context of this forum. If this is elitist, then so be it.
...
Also, you are not the only program that is not used to this format. For the record, this was BG's first ever NAQT tournament.
...
In conclusion, your own post does exactly what you say we sould not do. Your comments indicate that you think that BG is a powerhouse with a lot of experience. We are not. I was once in your shoes. The difference is that I did not get got angry. I got even. Hopefully, you can help guide your team to do the same.
So....basically, you're trying to say that we should all pat you guys on the back for starting from the bottom and being "okay" AND that you're now good enough to make imperious proclamations about the inadequacy of the students of an entire program? Where do you get off accusing the R-B coach of getting "angry" where you merely got "even"? Did you honestly think, "Gee, this team didn't know a lot of basic quiz bowl stuff and consequently didn't score many points; I bet they're not capable of figuring that out themselves, so I will proceed to let them know that my team (which I admit isn't close to beating the best teams in the state) thinks that they are very, very bad and should have given us more of a challenge"?

I do commend you and your team for your dedication to getting better, but it doesn't seem like you guys have picked up the concepts of humility and respect that one would expect from a team that apparently pulled itself up by its bootstraps. Making repeated remarks about the inability of inexperienced teams to answer questions is by no means appropriate, and I'd really appreciate it if you would knock it off and stop trying to defend your false sense of superiority.
I agree that I went a little too far in my defense of David and probably got a little too angry.

For the record, David was a jerk in his original post. I tried to defend him but actually came off as a jerk. I did not play R-B at all and honestly do not even know how their teams did. Many of the things that he said about David were correct and the opening line of my last post was actually not meant to be sarcastic (though I can see how it came out that way). I guess the line that angered me in his post was "My point is that you can judge us harshly for trying and ultimately being NO match for your teams". For some reason, I got the impression that he was mocking Auburn and Loyola for being good, as though that he meant Auburn and Chicagoland when he said "you", in response to David's grouping of Auburn and Chicagoland. After reading this through, he probably was under the impression that BG had two teams. I also did not read through the other points of the coach's post to realize the joking tone that he was using.

Naren asked the question "Do you seriously think that mocking other teams will make them want to do good quizbowl?". I am not joking when I say that Garb would seriously answer this question "yes". This is how he works. As I edited in to my last post, David responds well to mockery. I understand it sounds like a dumb excuse for his actions, but it is a legitimate excuse. He does the exact same thing to his own teammates (as you well know, Auburn). It is something that you get used to. Hopefully, this will teach David a lesson.

As for myself, I have no excuses. I just let my anger, which should not have existed at all, lead to a stupid post. The compliments I gave the R-B coach were not sarcastic. He seems like a nice enough guy who actually cares about his program being good. I am glad that he is willing to bring his team to New Trier and I did not mean to be rude to him in the way that I was. My goal was not to make R-B feel inadequate. My goal was to defend David's remarks, which I probably should have read.

I could go on all day about what I was thinking or not thinking, but I think that I am getting repetitive right now. Honestly, if I was a 3rd party, I would agree with everything Siva said.

On a seperate note, I would also like to thank the IHSSBCA for their announcement this week. This is a great step forward in promoting good quizbowl around the state.

Once again, sorry. :sad:

Edit: Stop Garb. I know you are not trying to be arrogant, but you sure are coming off that way. If you want to defend yourself, you can do it in two weeks at New Trier
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Buffalo Grove High School '09
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by BGSO » Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:17 pm

I also apologize, I said stuff, it was dumb, I tried to defend myself more and came of as dumber, I'm gonna stop digging my grave and just lay in it now.

EDIT: Nick also has bad puntuation, I think he meant to say...

Therefore, when I call a team a "bad team", I am not saying that you are a dumb bunch of people, or are a bad program, or everybody from Richmond is inadequate. What I am saying is that, at this moment, you have not done the work to be considered anything other than a bad team in the context of this forum. If this is elitist, then so be it.

instead of...

Therefore, when I call a team a "bad team", I am not saying that you are a dumb bunch of people, you are a bad program, and everybody from Richmond is inadequate. What I am saying is that, at this moment, you have not done the work to be considered anything other than a bad team in the context of this forum. If this is elitist, then so be it.
Last edited by BGSO on Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Buffalo Grove High School '09
UIUC-'13

Former member of the most dysfunctional scholastic bowl team in Illinois.
(11:23:30 PM) garb: Wait, are you talking about the porn or the reeses?

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by jonah » Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:18 pm

BGSO wrote:All of the sudden now we are elitist and arrogant? :w-hat:
No, not all of a sudden, or even all of the sudden (whatever that means); you've long been pretty elitist and arrogant, it's just that it wasn't always so incredibly objectionable and contrary to the goal of many of the rest of us, which is to advance the broad state of quizbowl in Illinois. Your statements about teams who obviously came to a tournament for the purpose of improving were belittling, anticonstructive, and totally inappropriate, and your challenge to a coach was ill-conceived at best. Obviously he already wants his team to get better, and took a great step by going to Decemberist; no good is likely to be had by goading him. If you can't help him and his team positively, then better you should step aside and let the constructive ones among us do so if he welcomes it.

You're not proving anything to anyone by being arrogant; if you want to prove your worth, the way to do it is to win tournaments. I'm currently in the process of writing a tournament that would be a suitable opportunity for you to do so; go study up so you can win it and win back a little respect.
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National Academic Quiz Tournaments

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Siverus Snape » Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:35 pm

I think there's a key difference in attitude that you're missing here, David. I'm not trying to defend Zahed and Jack (or any of the other people who sometimes say arrogant things, including me) categorically; for example, I feel that the word "inferior" is too charged and too easily misconstrued to be used to describe weaker teams. But even Jack's and Zahed's posts had a clear purpose beyond "wow, these other teams are really, really bad." I understand you may not have meant it that way, but the language you used and the number of times you repeated yourself screamed "I am a douchebag." In three sentences, you managed to call certain teams bad, shockingly bad, and pathetic. We get it. Those of us who have been heavily involved in the circuit for a long time are quite aware of the gap in quiz bowl ability, and it's simply not necessary to be so unabashedly rude about it.

Maybe you just have an incurable case of foot-in-mouth syndrome, or maybe you really do feel that it's worthwhile to repeatedly point out the flaws of currently weak teams who are on the verge of dedication and improvement. Either way, you reflect badly on the rest of the state and those people who have done concrete things to make changes for the better when you say things like that.

EDIT: Well, in the time it's taken me to write this, several people have piled it on and David has apologized, but I really don't feel like wasting this effort, so I'll post it anyway.
Siva Sundaram, Rockford Auburn High School '09

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by AKKOLADE » Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:41 pm

Dear BG Kids,

Stop.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Charley Pride » Sun Dec 07, 2008 10:14 pm

Everybody needs to settle down a bit. David and Nick, you guys have already expressed enough contrition, and the more you keep apologizing, the more you'll sound ridiculous. That said, they have apologized, so let's not have everyone just start waling on them. What they said was dumb, they've admitted it, so let's move on.

A few things that were encouraging yesterday:

1. East High School, a local school, brought two teams. This is an encouraging sign from a team that almost never is competitive, especially with the departure of Bruce. I will never stop emphasizing how much I prefer a B-team getting destroyed to playing with four or five on the bench with only one team. Playing is always better than not playing, and when a team that couldn't even get enough players a conference meets a year ago now has more than enough, it's a good thing.

2. A team like Richmond-Burton had something to show for coming. Yeah, they didn't win any hardware, but they played meaningful games in the afternoon. I've decided that my favorite method for afternoon play is the rebracketing method, because is puts teams against other teams of comparable quality. Our D-team went 1-4 in the morning and 4-1 in the afternoon (losing to R-B, my brother tells me). Rebracketing gives teams a chance to prove themselves against similar teams.

3. When teams got slaughtered, they didn't seem to lose heart. Sure, no one likes to lose, but I can say that I never saw poor sportsmanship from any team we played against, even if they lost by 300, 400 points. Yeah, some were squirrely and sometimes downright annoying, but it's better than getting pissed off and whining about the format or that it's not fair to have to play good teams.

And there's nothing like the ego check. I was amused when a coach asked us after a match where Auburn was from and told us he had never heard of us. He may have been new, but it told me not to get haughty when thinking of our standing in this state.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by BGWallace13 » Sun Dec 07, 2008 10:23 pm

Let me first say that even though I go to BG, I am trying to write a post that is unbiased as much as possible.

1. I agree with most everyone on the forum that said that David and Nick were arrogant with their posts. They stepped out of line when they mentioned teams by name in making fun of them. They should have realized that in any sport or activity there are the highest of the highs and the lowest of the lows. They should realize that they are privileged with their gift as quiz bowl players. Their wording in their posts were completely unacceptable and their views should not be considered as consistent with the rest of the team.

2. Knowing those two for the past 2.5 years, I have seen them be rude, arrogant, and obnoxious, but I have also seen them be very gracious. Just recently they have been two of the leading supporters of the idea to not send Team Illinois to Florida. With the money saved, they wanted it to be turned into grants given to students from teams at the turnabout tournaments. The grants would be used to send kids to ACE camps. Nick and David realized that ACE camp was one of the reasons why they turned into good quiz bowl players. They wanted to help teams from around the state get better at quiz bowl, although their posts may not seem like it.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Irreligion in Bangladesh » Mon Dec 08, 2008 4:24 am

Woohoo! Stats are done!

There'll be a general end-of-tournament-thank-you-for-coming-here-are-results-do-you-have-any-feedback email going out to coaches and staff later today, but here we go:

Morning only stats: http://results.scobo.net/resultmenu.asp ... llege&id=2
Afternoon only stats: http://results.scobo.net/resultmenu.asp ... llege&id=3
Combined stats: http://results.scobo.net/resultmenu.asp ... llege&id=1

Dixon left at the lunch break (although they graciously offered to stay if leaving would ruin the bracket), Hampshire left after 2 playoff games (explained to me prior to the tournament), and Sterling left after 4 playoff games (band conflict, also explained prior to tournament). At the moment, afternoon only isn't working, I'll get that fixed in a sec.

All-Tournament Team (in order of PPG, prelims only):
Siva Sundaram, Auburn A
Machamp, Loyola A
David Garb, Buffalo Grove
Nick Bergeon, Buffalo Grove
Michael Jiang, Auburn A
Slowpoke, Loyola B
Connor Christensen, Sterling A
Psyduck, Loyola A
Danny H., Boylan
Poliwrath, Loyola C

I'd also like to officially and honorably mention Jamie Kelly of Richmond Burton (finished 2 ppg behind 10th place in the morning, then jumped to 3rd overall) and Marc Smith of Byron (also finished 2 ppg behind 10th place in the morning, tied for 2nd most powers in the morning, 5th most powers overall). Both of you can purchase a used book from your local library, a ribbon from your local awards store, and send me the bill. :)

If you see any errors, email me. I just fixed a bunch related to switching Dixon and Loyola D and with players on Loyola C, so there might be more in there. Also, I'm going to bed now, but in the morning I'll add Loyola's real names to their psuedonym entries. Enjoy perusing!
Last edited by Irreligion in Bangladesh on Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by Siverus Snape » Mon Dec 08, 2008 9:36 am

I don't think it matters that much, but it looks like you switched stat lines for Zahed and me during our first game against Loyola A.
Siva Sundaram, Rockford Auburn High School '09

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Re: Illinois '08-'09

Post by the return of AHAN » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:02 pm

We interrupt this high school board to bring you the following field updates:
BARRINGTON INVITATIONAL SCHOLASTIC BOWL TOURNAMENT VI
3.14.09
REGISTERED TEAMS
Barrington Station (2 or 3)
Barrington Prairie (2)
Beecher
Bolingrbrook Humphrey
Cary JHS (2)
Streator Northlawn
Lemont Old Quarry
Lincolnshire Daniel Wright (2)
Lake Zurich South
Deerfield Holy Cross
Ottawa Shepherd

And from the Northwestern Quizbowl site regarding the Junior Wildcat (2.21.09):
Registered teams:
Barrington Station (2)
Mt Prospect St. Raymond (1-2)
Bloomington JHS
Bolingbrook Brooks Middle
Willowbrook Westview Hills
Barrington Prairie
Antioch Upper Grade School
Lincolnshire Daniel Wright School (1-2)
Streator Northlawn School
Crystal Lake Lundahl
Cary (2)
Lake in the Hills Marlowe
Holy Cross--Deerfield
Antioch (2)

I think it's worth noting that BOTH of these tournaments advertise pyramidal toss-ups. :grin: So, it appears if you'd like another way to raise some finds for your quizbowl program, put on a middle school tournament, because the demand is clearly there.
Jeff Price
Barrington High School Coach
Barrington Station Middle School Coach (2013 MSNCT Champions, 2013 & 2017 Illinois Class AA State Champions)
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