Trash Comes to Illinois

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Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Dan-Don » Wed May 20, 2009 1:18 pm

I (Dan Donohue, Saint Viator '10) and Jeff Geringer (Saint Viator '09) are currently in the process of writing an ACF-style trash tournament for the 2009-2010 high school season in Illinois.

After talking today with Mr. Riley of Loyola, it appears that Loyola would be interested in hosting this tournament, provided it is held next spring (thus avoiding conflicts with any other tournaments) as a small solo tournament (since this does not fit the IHSA's definition of Scholastic Bowl).

Players: Would you be interested in playing a solo trash tournament in about a year's time?

Coaches: Would you take your players to such a tournament?

Moderators: Would enough of you be interested in coming to moderate?

With regards to distribution, I asked around and it seems like 4/4 Movies and TV, 4/4 Sports, 4/4 Music, 3/3 Games and Tech, 2/2 Lit, 3/3 Misc., Interdisc., Consumerism, Current Events, etc. seems pretty standard. I think Jeff wants 5/5 Movies and TV, 5/5 Music, 4/4 Sports, 2/2 Games and Tech, 2/2 Lit, and 2/2 Misc. Any thoughts on that?

As we write, we're unsure what to do about powers--if we should have them at all or have power marks, or count anything before FTP as power.

Tossups are about 100 words long.

We don't know right now how many players would be welcome or how much the entry fee will be. Any thoughts?

If you have any other comments or suggestions, please post them here.
Dan Donohue, Saint Viator ('10), Northwestern ('14), NAQT

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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Dresden_The_BIG_JERK » Wed May 20, 2009 1:30 pm

Yes a million times to moderating this.

4/4 Movies and TV, 4/4 Sports, 4/4 Music, 3/3 Games and Tech, 2/2 Lit, 3/3 Misc. sounds like a good format.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Tegan » Wed May 20, 2009 2:52 pm

If not otherwise engaged, I would love to moderate.

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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Kanga-Rat Murder Society » Wed May 20, 2009 3:26 pm

This is an awesome announcement, though you guys are doing this one year too late. However, I think that it is important that this tournament be paired with an academic one. Illinois is full of teams that do not actually care about Scholastic Bowl. These schools have teams that exist simply because the school administrators think it makes the school sound good and teachers want more money. My fear is that this tournament, if run alone, would encourage these teams and their coaches to spend their funds on Trash tournaments, rather than academic ones. If this tournament is paired with an academic one, it will encourage these teams to attend the academic one.

The problem with this pairing is that Loyola only runs three tournaments. The first, Ultima, is invitation only. The second, D&G, is a Frosh-Soph tournament. That leaves Loyburn as the best option for a pairing to occur, but it is very late in the year.

So this leads to the question: When is Loyola planning on hosting this?
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Dan-Don » Wed May 20, 2009 4:02 pm

BG MSL Champs wrote:My fear is that this tournament, if run alone, would encourage these teams and their coaches to spend their funds on Trash tournaments, rather than academic ones. If this tournament is paired with an academic one, it will encourage these teams to attend the academic one.

The problem with this pairing is that Loyola only runs three tournaments. The first, Ultima, is invitation only. The second, D&G, is a Frosh-Soph tournament. That leaves Loyburn as the best option for a pairing to occur, but it is very late in the year.

So this leads to the question: When is Loyola planning on hosting this?
Good question. From what I could gather from Mr. Riley's email, he was hoping to do this in the Spring, out of season. I think your points about pairing it with an academic tournament are fair, however. So we'll have to see what happens.
Dan Donohue, Saint Viator ('10), Northwestern ('14), NAQT

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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by AKKOLADE » Wed May 20, 2009 4:07 pm

Ignoring the whole "trash for high schoolers thing" (you should really pair this with an academic event), 4/4 split between TV and movies? That's way too much, and I'm someone who shrunk the distro to 3/3 each.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Theory Of The Leisure Flask » Wed May 20, 2009 6:06 pm

FredMorlan wrote:Ignoring the whole "trash for high schoolers thing" (you should really pair this with an academic event), 4/4 split between TV and movies? That's way too much, and I'm someone who shrunk the distro to 3/3 each.
I think they mean 4/4 movies and TV combined, not 4/4 each.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Dan-Don » Wed May 20, 2009 6:10 pm

Theory Of The Leisure Flask wrote:
FredMorlan wrote:Ignoring the whole "trash for high schoolers thing" (you should really pair this with an academic event), 4/4 split between TV and movies? That's way too much, and I'm someone who shrunk the distro to 3/3 each.
I think they mean 4/4 movies and TV combined, not 4/4 each.
That's correct, Leisure Flask. Each round is 20 questions, tossups only (because it's a solo) distributed as follows:

4 Movies & TV
4 Music
4 Sports
3 Games & Tech
2 Lit
3 Misc.
Dan Donohue, Saint Viator ('10), Northwestern ('14), NAQT

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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Geringer » Wed May 20, 2009 7:05 pm

Yes, ladies and germs, our distribution is as listed above by Dan.

As a side note, I was originally hoping to make this a full-team, ACF-bonus style event. As in, 20/20 not just 20. That said, I would be looking for a buyer/mirror for the entire set, including bonuses. Would it be worth a repost somewhere else on the forum? I mean, I'm not trying to steal someone's first-born child here, but I need money to buy nice things for myself, like beef-flavored raman noodles and EasyMac. Does anyone know if there are any colleges/non-Illinois high schools willing to purchase an entire trash set from me for a nominal fee?

Yes, I have officially moved from math to trash. Next step: create some good old-fashioned computational trash.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by AKKOLADE » Wed May 20, 2009 7:53 pm

Theory Of The Leisure Flask wrote:
FredMorlan wrote:Ignoring the whole "trash for high schoolers thing" (you should really pair this with an academic event), 4/4 split between TV and movies? That's way too much, and I'm someone who shrunk the distro to 3/3 each.
I think they mean 4/4 movies and TV combined, not 4/4 each.
That's exactly my point. 4/4 on that stuff is entirely too little.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by JackGlerum » Wed May 20, 2009 8:31 pm

I think it's a fine idea, but I'm 100% with Nick on this--it should be after a normal tournament. A stand-alone trash tournament in high school is promoting the wrong thing, I think. Rather than having it in the Spring, when many Illinois quizbowlers are unfortunately in "the off-season" (and thus less likely to know/care about something like this), I'd contact a tournament host (once IHSSBCA releases the schedule), and ask them if they'd be willing to keep their doors open a few extra hours for those who wanna play trash.

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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by TheDoctor » Thu May 21, 2009 12:42 am

This sounds like a lot of fun. I (and, I'm sure, Brad) will definitely read for this, barring previous commitments.

If you decide to go with Jack's suggestion and can't swing it any other way, I can offer NIU as a venue.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by David Riley » Thu May 21, 2009 7:46 am

I would have no objection to connecting it with an academic tournament, but how many rounds are we talking here? If you mean in addition to a standard 11-15 round academic tournament, that may be a bit much, which is why I was looking toward an early spring date. Other options would be to host it after a "standard Illinois" tournament, which is at mot 9 rounds, or begin the tournament after the morning rouns, possibly.

Again, keep in mind the whole moderator situation; you don't want more teams than available moderators.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Dan-Don » Thu May 21, 2009 8:30 am

TheDoctor wrote:If you decide to go with Jack's suggestion and can't swing it any other way, I can offer NIU as a venue.
Thanks for the offer, Kristen. I'll keep it in mind. If Loyola doesn't work out, when would be the best weekend to do this at NIU?
David Riley wrote:I would have no objection to connecting it with an academic tournament, but how many rounds are we talking here? If you mean in addition to a standard 11-15 round academic tournament, that may be a bit much, which is why I was looking toward an early spring date. Other options would be to host it after a "standard Illinois" tournament, which is at mot 9 rounds, or begin the tournament after the morning rouns, possibly.

Again, keep in mind the whole moderator situation; you don't want more teams than available moderators.
Well...I imagined this a lot like the UIUC Solo after NAQT State last March. That proved you can play a 9 (or was it 10?) round solo after an entire tournament and still leave at a late, but not entirely unreasonable, hour. Thoughts?
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by David Riley » Thu May 21, 2009 9:16 am

That would work, my point was that you need to have the logistics in place (e.g. moderators, etc.) before you plan on something on that scale.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Dan-Don » Thu May 21, 2009 12:51 pm

David Riley wrote:That would work, my point was that you need to have the logistics in place (e.g. moderators, etc.) before you plan on something on that scale.

OK. So first we have to work on getting enough moderators. But before we do that, we have a to pick a date. Based on the feedback in this thread, we'll be hosting this after a "real" quiz bowl tournament at either Loyola or NIU. So, to Kristen and Mr. Riley: What days does that leave us with?

Once we pick the day, we can work out how many moderators we'll need, how many players will come, the tournament's structure, how many rounds, etc.
Dan Donohue, Saint Viator ('10), Northwestern ('14), NAQT

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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Deviant Insider » Thu May 21, 2009 1:23 pm

We'll have a more complete and fixed calendar next week, but as of right now it appears that Ultima is 10/17, Decemberist is 12/5, Loyola Frosh/Soph is 1/16, and Huskie Bowl is 2/6.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Dan-Don » Thu May 21, 2009 6:06 pm

Shcool wrote:We'll have a more complete and fixed calendar next week, but as of right now it appears that Ultima is 10/17, Decemberist is 12/5, Loyola Frosh/Soph is 1/16, and Huskie Bowl is 2/6.
I talked to Mr. Riley again and it seems like we can pair this with Ultima...assuming he gets a question set for Ultima. He is limited to 16 rooms, so we can welcome 32 players from the 16 teams that will be at Ultima that day. We've decided that the format will 5 20-question solo games (tossups only) done with power pairings. The 4 best players (by record, then total points) will go a Round Robin championship pool for Rounds 6-8. The other players will be ranked and put into Consolation pools to play Rounds 6-8 (if they wish). Between now and the tournament, we can decrease the number of rounds if there is a call for a shorter tournament. Hopefully, the Ultima moderators will stay and read this tournament. If not, Jeff and I will step in and read. Are there any major flaws in this plan? Also, what is a typical entry fee for such a tournament?
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Jane Fairfax » Thu May 28, 2009 1:47 pm

Can't wait for this.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by abnormal abdomen » Sun May 31, 2009 8:57 pm

Jane Fairfax wrote:Can't wait for this.
Agreed.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Boeing X-20, Please! » Mon Jul 27, 2009 5:27 pm

I understand it's hard to do this with getting many moderators and all but 32 people out of 16 teams seems like too little considering the fact that most of my school will want to do it since it'll be at LA and we could participate without getting home at an unreasonable hour and there seems to be interest from other schools *cough* Rockford-Auburn *cough* whose teammates might feel left out if their team decides to stay or the players involved might have a hard time getting back. I understand that some teams will just leave after Ultima which will reduce the number of players significantly but I still think there will be more than 32, so maybe you could try something like a doubles tourney which I'm sure the two above me would be interested in.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Dan-Don » Tue Jul 28, 2009 8:08 pm

MoCity02 wrote:I understand that some teams will just leave after Ultima which will reduce the number of players significantly but I still think there will be more than 32, so maybe you could try something like a doubles tourney which I'm sure the two above me would be interested in.
My co-writer, Jeff, kicked around the idea of a doubles tourney at the very beginning of this process, and Mr. Riley suggested it to me last month when I was at camp. I can't say for sure until I see how many people sign up when we send out an invite, but it seems very likely this will be a doubles event.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by David Riley » Wed Jul 29, 2009 1:22 am

Welcome to the boards, Mo! :grin:
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by Geringer » Wed Jul 29, 2009 8:28 am

All ten rounds worth of music for Trashtastrophe are done. Otherwise, I think 8 full rounds are completed.
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Re: Trash Comes to Illinois

Post by David Riley » Wed Jul 29, 2009 8:40 am

Great news! Any questions about Motown girl groups of the sixties? :grin: :grin:
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