List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by New York Undercover »

I know this is not really something that can be easily answered, but do you know how hosting HSNCT in Texas in 2000 and 2002 affected turnout? Since the highest quizbowl density is in the east, were there fewer teams, proportionally, attending from that region because of the distance?

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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

Unfortunately, I think comparing the HSNCT in 2000-2002 with the HSNCT in 2011 is an apple-orange thing. At the time, the HSNCT was still an upstart vying with the Chip Beall machine, and pyramidal circuits were only beginning to emerge most places. As such, the tournament moving all over the place every year may have been much more unpredictable because the tournament simply had a much smaller base to begin with. Now, the HSNCT is a monolith that has a gigantic drawing power, so numbers have less potential to be anomalous.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Charbroil »

Arsonists Get All the Girls wrote:Are there a lot of teams in the St. Louis region?
Not only in a word, "yes," but St. Louis has most if not all of the other advantages that Chicago does, as far as I'm aware.

I mean, I'm obviously biased in this regard, but I'm pretty sure people will agree with me on that.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

Well, what building would be the host? I have heard that were we to use a hotel downtown, we would need to hold the event in two separate buildings that have nothing connecting them. I think teams having to cross the street between games could be a dealbreaker for an event that requires a certain amount of efficiency.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

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Jeremy Gibbs Freesy Does It wrote:Well, what building would be the host? I have heard that were we to use a hotel downtown, we would need to hold the event in two separate buildings that have nothing connecting them. I think teams having to cross the street between games could be a dealbreaker for an event that requires a certain amount of efficiency.
I was probably too quick in saying that St. Louis had all of the advantages that Chicago had; the thought did cross my mind that I had no idea if a suitable host could be found.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Irreligion in Bangladesh »

Also, I think Chicago wins on the "cheap reimbursements for driving in the bushels of local staff" front, too.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Deviant Insider »

Charbroil wrote:
Jeremy Gibbs Freesy Does It wrote:Well, what building would be the host? I have heard that were we to use a hotel downtown, we would need to hold the event in two separate buildings that have nothing connecting them. I think teams having to cross the street between games could be a dealbreaker for an event that requires a certain amount of efficiency.
I was probably too quick in saying that St. Louis had all of the advantages that Chicago had; the thought did cross my mind that I had no idea if a suitable host could be found.
That's actually not a huge problem. If each building has at least 32 rooms and they keep 192 teams, then you can design a schedule so that teams only switch buildings during byes. You can even make even those building switches pretty rare.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by at your pleasure »

The other idea that assumes a minimum of 32 rooms per building would be to have 6 pools of 32 teams and run a card system in each pool with the top X in each pool making the playoffs. That way, everyone would play all their prelim games in the same building.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Terrible Shorts Depot »

Switching buildings is a terrible idea. Don't even attempt it.

I see no reason to move HSNCT from Chicago. Two massive airports, good public transportation, a really central location, and bushels of local staff make it a better site than any other city in the country. Stop complaining about the tourism being boring, because, ultimately, you're playing a quizbowl tournament, not going on vacation. Also, there's more than enough stuff for 4 years worth of tourism in Chicago.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Important Bird Area »

Westwon wrote: That's actually not a huge problem. If each building has at least 32 rooms and they keep 192 teams, then you can design a schedule so that teams only switch buildings during byes. You can even make even those building switches pretty rare.
Worth noting that in addition to the Hyatt Regency this year's HSNCT is using part of the adjacent Convention Center (which has a skyway connection). I think the Saturday schedule has been worked out such that teams will only switch buildings during their byes, but more details to follow after ICT.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by btressler »

Terrible Shorts Depot wrote:I see no reason to move HSNCT from Chicago.
I'll give you two: the travel costs are not equal for all attendees, and I really liked traveling to different destinations. Though I have no intention of going back to Chip, at least I got to visit New Orleans and San Antonio.

Those of us having financial challenges would very much appreciate a location closer to home one of these years.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by jonpin »

Terrible Shorts Depot wrote:Switching buildings is a terrible idea. Don't even attempt it.

I see no reason to move HSNCT from Chicago. Two massive airports, good public transportation, a really central location, and bushels of local staff make it a better site than any other city in the country. Stop complaining about the tourism being boring, because, ultimately, you're playing a quizbowl tournament, not going on vacation. Also, there's more than enough stuff for 4 years worth of tourism in Chicago.
I don't know whether there's a specific location that would work, but much of what you've said describes the DC metro area as well, with three airports within reasonable distance and a ton of local college quizbowl players for staffing purposes. I can understand not wanting both nationals in the same area, though, so with PACE being in the DC area for three straight years, it wouldn't necessarily make sense for NAQT to move there.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Carolus Magnus »

I like Memphis and St. Louis as possible locations; they're centrally-located (for the most part) and quite metropolitan, while not overly expensive areas geared at a lot of tourism (looking at you, D.C. and NYC). Nashville is a nice location also, with plenty of things for patrons to check out in their downtime.

Perhaps South Carolina cities like Columbia and Charleston are worth considering? The latter is pretty expensive, though, and they're both a little more spread-out than Chi-town and some of the other candidates.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

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Carolus Magnus wrote:I like Memphis and St. Louis as possible locations; they're centrally-located (for the most part) and quite metropolitan, while not overly expensive areas geared at a lot of tourism (looking at you, D.C. and NYC). Nashville is a nice location also, with plenty of things for patrons to check out in their downtime.

Perhaps South Carolina cities like Columbia and Charleston are worth considering? The latter is pretty expensive, though, and they're both a little more spread-out than Chi-town and some of the other candidates.
I don't know about you, but I lived in South Carolina for nine years and didn't find either city particularly exciting.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Rococo A Go Go »

Well, I personally think the quizbowl community shouldn't be hosting events in South Carolina for the same reason that the NCAA won't go there...but that's a really touchy discussion to get into. Besides, neither city mentioned has the transportation resources to meet what the quizbowl community needs.

Since WKU is an hour away from Nashville, I'm obviously going to cheerlead for the Music City. It is fairly centrally located and is already hosting a national all-star tourney this year. Memphis and St. Louis would also be places I'd like to see it in, although I know significantly less about them. Nashville (and has demonstrated this in the past) definitely has the ability to host large national events.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by almond joy »

Golran wrote:Maybe a rotation like
1)Northeast/Midatlantic (NY/NJ/MA/PA/DE/MD etc?)
2)Upper Midwest
3)Lower Midwest
4)Southeast (GA/FL/SC etc)
5)Region of lower concentration(like CA/AZ/WA/NV/TX/ID/HI? [who wouldn't want to go to Hawaii?]/other random regions that don's fit well into other classifications)
While teams do exist in the west, they're not in as high concentrations as the other major regions, and should not warrant the hosting every four years.
You must keep in mind schools like mine with little to no funding for quiz bowl. Every year it is a fight to even get money to go to Chicago (90 miles away). Air fare to Hawaii is absurd, and my team would not be able to attend. I think it should remain in the midwest. St. Louis would still be great for us, and it is centrally located.

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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Ditzy Blonde »

Nashville or Atlanta would be awesome... "Southern hospitality" goes a long way... in most cases (but not all) you can get free internet at a LOT of hotels in the south AND most of your restaurants, even McDonald's, give you free refills on your drinks...can't find that in Chicago!!!
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Terrible Shorts Depot »

Ditzy Blonde wrote:Nashville or Atlanta would be awesome... "Southern hospitality" goes a long way... in most cases (but not all) you can get free internet at a LOT of hotels in the south AND most of your restaurants, even McDonald's, give you free refills on your drinks...can't find that in Chicago!!!
Might as well have Nationals in Minneapolis. "Minnesota nice" is occasionally oppressive.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Kwang the Ninja »

Terrible Shorts Depot wrote:
Ditzy Blonde wrote:Nashville or Atlanta would be awesome... "Southern hospitality" goes a long way... in most cases (but not all) you can get free internet at a LOT of hotels in the south AND most of your restaurants, even McDonald's, give you free refills on your drinks...can't find that in Chicago!!!
Might as well have Nationals in Minneapolis. "Minnesota nice" is occasionally oppressive.
Didn't ICT work pretty well in Minnesota? I think that'd be a nice alternative, plus R. is right in the neighborhood.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

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Never change a winning team... my vote is for Chicago, and not only because we are only 2.5 hours away.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Nuclear Densometer Test »

Can we do this Olympic style and have bids?

But either way, I like Minneapolis as a venue as well as Nashville (assuming NASAT isn't there next year too) and maybe even a Texan city if that can garner enough support.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Charbroil »

Nuclear Densometer Test wrote:Can we do this Olympic style and have bids?
They do have bids, remember? Locations (Hotels, colleges, etc.) bid on each upcoming HSNCT.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

Didn't ICT work pretty well in Minnesota?
From what I heard, no.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by naturalistic phallacy »

Jeremy Gibbs Freesy Does It wrote:
Didn't ICT work pretty well in Minnesota?
From what I heard, no.
Since I wasn't a part of this, could someone explain exactly what people disliked about having the tournament here? We've never heard significant complaints from people when running MO, so I am curious as to what went wrong.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by Matt Weiner »

A lot of teams are self-funded and just can't come up with the money necessary to fly four people to Minneapolis, on top of the ICT entry fee. MO is a smaller event for more dedicated people, and it doesn't have an entry fee that costs as much as an additional plane ticket. Having the ICT in a place that many teams can drive to is a must until such time as the general funding situation improves.

Similar statements probably apply to the HSNCT, though to a lesser degree.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by naturalistic phallacy »

Matt Weiner wrote:A lot of teams are self-funded and just can't come up with the money necessary to fly four people to Minneapolis, on top of the ICT entry fee. MO is a smaller event for more dedicated people, and it doesn't have an entry fee that costs as much as an additional plane ticket. Having the ICT in a place that many teams can drive to is a must until such time as the general funding situation improves.

Similar statements probably apply to the HSNCT, though to a lesser degree.
Ok, that makes sense. I wasn't sure if there were some great logistical problems with getting around Minneapolis or something.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by theMoMA »

Minneapolis now has both Southwest and Sun Country, so it shouldn't be as expensive anymore.
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Re: List places you'd like to see the 2011 HSNCT

Post by The Friar »

bt_green_warbler wrote:
Westwon wrote: That's actually not a huge problem. If each building has at least 32 rooms and they keep 192 teams, then you can design a schedule so that teams only switch buildings during byes. You can even make even those building switches pretty rare.
Worth noting that in addition to the Hyatt Regency this year's HSNCT is using part of the adjacent Convention Center (which has a skyway connection). I think the Saturday schedule has been worked out such that teams will only switch buildings during their byes, but more details to follow after ICT.
In downtown St. Louis, the America's Center has up to 80 meeting rooms, and the Renaissance Grand hotel, attached by a covered walkway, has 33. If a large portion of the convention center could be used this would accommodate even the absolute largest proposed field sizes. I have no idea how rates compare, but would suspect lower demand means meeting rooms in downtown St. Louis cost less than ones in the O'Hare area.
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