Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

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Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Mechanical Beasts » Sun Sep 12, 2010 11:20 pm

Hey--

This is the official announcement for a mirror of Valencia's Delta Burke novice set to be held at Harvard on Sunday, November 14th, 2010. High school teams who attended HFT the previous day are invited, but the central aim is to provide this tournament for novice teams from around the area--so if there are too many, too good high school teams, the possibility remains that they'll be placed in a separate division.

PRICING:

The standard suite of prices--$100 per team, $10 off per buzzer or moderator provided--will apply.

LOCATION:

The tournament will take place in Emerson Hall. (The map is more detailed this year!) Note that this means that we will not be meeting in the Fong Auditorium, as we do on Saturday for HFT. Rather, we will meet in Emerson 101. (Emerson 101 will be a game room during the day, however; the stat room will just be one of the benches in the Emerson hallway.)

FORMAT:

Eleven teams are playing, so the format will be an eleven round round robin followed by an ACF final. Teams will almost certainly have to staff on their byes--we apologize for the inconvenience.

FIELD (11):

LASA (4)
Hunter (2 teams, 2 buzzers)
Princeton (3)
MIT (1)
House (1)
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Cassian » Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:24 am

Any news on the field for this? Not that I mind our kids playing Hunter a bunch of times, but I'm hoping some more teams are coming...
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Youse Da Force » Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:23 pm

I'm registering two for Princeton now...
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Waterworks » Sat Oct 30, 2010 10:06 pm

Brandeis will send 1-2 teams, with the exact number to be decided by Tuesday.

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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Waterworks » Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:32 pm

Sorry for taking so long to confirm. We will come with one team and one buzzer set.

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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Kaisuopai » Thu Nov 11, 2010 12:04 pm

Is it too late for MIT to confirm about sending 1 team?
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Mechanical Beasts » Thu Nov 11, 2010 12:55 pm

Kaisuopai wrote:Is it too late for MIT to confirm about sending 1 team?
We'd have to kill the house team; on the other hand, killing the house team gives us enough staff to not need bye staffers. I'll email around about it.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Mechanical Beasts » Fri Nov 12, 2010 5:28 pm

All--

Play will start at 9:00am: please show up by then or let me know that you can't make it.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Mechanical Beasts » Sat Nov 13, 2010 3:50 pm

Update--Brandeis dropped. With the staff I expect (Dallas, Sam/Katy, Stephen, a LASA alum) I don't believe we can run a ten-team tournament. So the house team is back in place, and one room will be staffed by whoever's on bye. Format: full round robin, then ACF finals.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by The Friar » Sat Nov 13, 2010 8:44 pm

As a result of WUStL's experience today at GIT, I recommend taking the time this evening or before the tournament in the morning to screen the packets for repeat questions. There were a few whole questions that got copied from the master document to more than one packet; for our purposes there were also plenty of questions in packets we didn't end up using to replace them.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by dsimons » Sun Nov 14, 2010 8:22 pm

Hunter A defeated LASA A in the second game of an advantaged final 345 - 340 to win the tournament. Stats will be posted by tomorrow.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by youngster68 » Mon Nov 15, 2010 4:45 pm

Lily could say this better than I, but I just wanted to say thanks for running a great show. We missed our 6:30 bus but that was just because of the thrilling finale against the thing we feared the most - LASA A! I don't think it was a coincidence that the final was in Room 101.

To come all the way from Austin to compete, and still perform at that level, and then on top of that to be such warm, gracious and sincere people - the students from LASA deserve all the accolades that they get. After beating us three times over the course of the weekend, we didn't expect to win, and if it weren't for their rare negs, we wouldn't have.

Dallas and the rest of the staff did a great job. We had a great weekend in Cambridge, and on both days our hosts turned what could have been major problems (scattered rooms, buzzer shortage) into minor bumps in the road. Many thanks and see you next year!
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by AKKOLADE » Tue Nov 16, 2010 12:07 am

dsimons wrote:Hunter A defeated LASA A in the second game of an advantaged final 345 - 340 to win the tournament. Stats will be posted by tomorrow.
YOU HAVE ONE HOUR GOOD SIR
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Edward Powers » Sun Nov 21, 2010 3:05 am

Dallas,

Any chance the stats will soon see the light of day? The victory of Hunter A over LASA A, given the results at HFT the day before, is intriguing, is it not? Care to share that info with the larger quizbowl community? And did the colleges involved perform well against these two excellent HS programs? Here again it seems that the stats might help.

(I understand you've had some computer problems with the stats, so if this is still the case, good luck with your efforts and ignore my gentle prodding here; if this is no longer the case, can you give your myriads of fans a ballpark estimate of when you might bring some wondrous closure to this issue?).

EDITED: To add a personal salutation and an amicable parenthetical comment.
Last edited by Edward Powers on Sun Nov 21, 2010 4:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Cassian » Sun Nov 21, 2010 3:55 pm

Coach Powers -

I can tell you from our perspective what happened on Sunday. First, Hunter is a very good and dangerous team. They have very deep knowledge and are very quick on the buzzers. Plus, they seem to be a bunch of very nice kids. Second, LASA A had something like 13 or 14 negs combined in the two final games. I can't exactly say why that happened, but when you do that against a team like Hunter, it's pretty difficult to win games. And of course, we didn't.

We also would love to see stats from Delta Burke and HFT, but I understand that Harvard is kind of a good academic school, and it sounded to me like Andy had some school work to do, so I'm sure he'll get to them when he can.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Edward Powers » Sun Nov 21, 2010 5:01 pm

Well said, Coach Flowers,

I've heard that rumor about Harvard Academics too, and, comically, just as you were posting to me, I realized that my earlier post might be construed as insensitive to Andy's more important scholarly obligations (again, the apparent consequences of that rumor!), and since I did not wish to either seem or to actually be insensitive to Andy, I decided to edit my post and make it more specific by addressing it to the actual TD of Delta Burke and not to Andy, thus removing Andy from any responsibility for these as yet unfulfilled TD responsibilities.

Further, my edit was designed to publish my own awareness that Dallas had in fact run into some computer problems with the stats, so that this awareness could be shared with the larger community, just in case those technical problems were not in fact known. I did this because it is my understanding that Dallas also attends that very same fairly good academic institution, and, being a person who for some strange reason believes in equity, I thought it would not be fair to ask Dallas to ignore his equally somewhat demanding academic obligations (that rumor applies to Dallas's workload too, I would assume) if the computer problem began to absorb too much of his scholarly time. Conversely, I did add, trying to actually be that comically equitable person I always hope to be, that if the computer glitch has in fact been resolved, then Dallas, who has obviously been trained at that rumored pretty good institution of higher learning, probably would have the intellectual wherewithal to be equitable in return to all of us in his national fanclub waiting for him to bring his first TD experience to full closure and at least, therefore, have the ability to compute a window of time for us that we could reasonably expect to see those stats. But, as you will no doubt discern, I let Dallas off the hook IF those computer gremlins were still thwarting his efforts.

So, you are correct coach---we in the audience out here should always appreciate the possible difficulties TD's face, and thus always try to be both fair and patient when difficulties actually do arise. So, I hope that the EDIT that I was serendipitously writing while you yourself gently prodded me to be understanding reveals that I absolutely agree with you and share your spirit. Further, you obviously have a more direct and personal reason to wish to see the stats, since it was the outstanding play of your kids throughout the entire weekend that made me suggest how intriguing those stats might be, for given your play at HFT, Hunter's performance at Delta Burke becomes quite interesting indeed. So it seems that if you could be patient when you were so directly involved, the rest of us should as well. And I not only agree with this sentiment, I admire it. But having said this and admitted this, my bet is that you would also agree that the spirit of equity and patience that we both seem to agree with also cuts in the other direction as well---if such a spirit of collegiality and respect for the difficulties and challenges faced by TD's who also have more important personal obligations at times counsels us to acknowledge the need to be patient and respectful of those complexities TD's sometimes face, so too does that very same spirit counsel that TD's return such collegiality to their audience as well, and at least provide an explanation for the delays they are encountering, and, where possible, a projected window of time they expect to fulfill their side of the mutual responsibilities that TD's and participants share with each other. Finally, if that projected window of time, for whatever reason cannot be met, a simple statement of this and a possible new projected time should be given, thereby showing that the TD's also honor the spirit of courtesy and respect that your post wisely, albeit indirectly, counsels.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by dsimons » Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:50 am

Here are the stats from Delta Burke. Sorry about the delay.

http://results.scobo.net/SQBS.aspx?org= ... =standings
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by etchdulac » Mon Nov 22, 2010 1:23 am

Hey, Coach Flowers -- are these pseudonyms, or did your actual A team players not play Sunday? The names I'm most familiar with are notably absent.

Indeed, which players were present Saturday and Sunday for LASA (and State College) remains a mystery to those of us unable to attend.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Cassian » Mon Nov 22, 2010 1:29 am

Are there high school players out there using pseudonyms? I'm shocked and dismayed...
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Edward Powers » Mon Nov 22, 2010 3:16 am

Thank you, Dallas.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by etchdulac » Mon Nov 22, 2010 3:47 am

Cassian wrote:Are there high school players out there using pseudonyms? I'm shocked and dismayed...
So... I can put you down as intentionally obscuring your teams' stats, yes? I enjoy the Moscow mass transit map on your wall, but the scoreboard page in Pravda is not as entertaining. Maybe your team labels can be Spartak, CSKA, Lokomotiv and Dinamo.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by ValenciaQBowl » Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:24 pm

Those are some robust bonus-conversion numbers! Even the lowest-ranked team averaged 14.75, which would've ranked around 4th or 5th (out of 30) at the main CC site in Orlando. I suppose this would indicate that the field here didn't find the bonuses too difficult.

Coaches and players, I'd be happy to hear your thoughts on the questions in the Delta Burke 2010 discussion thread.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by Cassian » Mon Nov 22, 2010 4:40 pm

For the record, I've never been to Moscow, so I'm guessing the map that used to be on my classroom wall was either from Paris or London (or maybe Berlin). Maybe next month I'll pick up a metro map from Tbilisi though - I bet that one is pretty interesting.

As for your other point, I'm not certain what you mean by 'intentionally obscuring' my team's stats. I'm relatively certain that our team statistics are all quite correct. Anyone who wishes to do so is free to compare our PPG and bonus conversion numbers on this set to anyone else's in the country, just as they will be with the HFT stats when they're posted. My A team chose, as a matter of team solidarity, to use pseudonyms for the entire weekend in Boston. I applaud their desire to place team goals over individual statistics, and, as far as I'm concerned, they are free to do so for the rest of the year. I'm not really trying to start up (or continue) the ongoing pseudonym debate, but that's my position on this particular situation.
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Re: Delta Burke Mirror at Harvard (11/14/10)

Post by etchdulac » Mon Nov 22, 2010 9:18 pm

Cassian wrote:For the record, I've never been to Moscow, so I'm guessing the map that used to be on my classroom wall was either from Paris or London (or maybe Berlin). Maybe next month I'll pick up a metro map from Tbilisi though - I bet that one is pretty interesting.

As for your other point, I'm not certain what you mean by 'intentionally obscuring' my team's stats. I'm relatively certain that our team statistics are all quite correct. Anyone who wishes to do so is free to compare our PPG and bonus conversion numbers on this set to anyone else's in the country, just as they will be with the HFT stats when they're posted. My A team chose, as a matter of team solidarity, to use pseudonyms for the entire weekend in Boston. I applaud their desire to place team goals over individual statistics, and, as far as I'm concerned, they are free to do so for the rest of the year. I'm not really trying to start up (or continue) the ongoing pseudonym debate, but that's my position on this particular situation.
Must've been another teacher's room we were in -- cyrillic being rather distinctive. Perhaps it was at St. John's and not at LASA that I saw that. Now that I revisit it, it was probably the same room with the Arsenal memorabilia in it, which was definitely Mr. Curry.

While individual statistics on consistent rosters are indeed of little concern, the team statistics issue that comes up regards the rotation of players across teams. While I'm guessing your A team will change little or none through the course of the season, any effort to rank or seed LASA B at later tournaments is reliant on knowing that team's roster through the course of the season, an effort that can be significantly hindered by pseudonyms.

While I imagine you must be in a position where fluidity between your non-varsity teams is a huge element of getting the best results out of your teams, it would create some deciphering for those trying to gauge stats across tournaments using varying pseudonyms.

If your players' pseudonyms were consistent, which for all I know they are, that wouldn't be a problem. But consistent pseudonyms would defeat the purpose, I suppose.

Or if your B team happens to be as well-defined as your A team.

Just a thought. Not likely something that ranks high among your concerns.
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