VETO?

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VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Fri Apr 22, 2011 10:44 pm

So I would love to have an excuse to play quizbowl in Toronto. However, I would really like to not play terrible quizbowl; as such, I would like to know if there's any chance that someone who knows how to write quizbowl questions might edit VETO this year. I don't care if there's 10/10 Canadiana that I've never heard of, but if I have to pick up a gobstopper, things will get hairy. So yeah, someone competent please edit VETO so I can write you a packet and play quizbowl in your lovely city.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Cheynem » Fri Apr 22, 2011 10:48 pm

So, last year, ANGST happened and there was chaos because Andy Saunders went AWOL, leaving some folks like Kurtis to pick up the pieces. I wonder if there's any interest in like something similar to ANGST (a packet submission, something on the easier side summer tournament), and if so, who would be the people to do this.

At the daring risk of biting off more than I can chew, I would offer to edit some categories (probably history or Americanist type stuff) if other collaborators can be found. I'm aware that this project would probably produce a wobbly kind of tournament, but come on, Jerry just said he would be okay with 10/10 things he never heard of.
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Re: VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Fri Apr 22, 2011 10:50 pm

Cheynem wrote: I'm aware that this project would probably produce a wobbly kind of tournament, but come on, Jerry just said he would be okay with 10/10 things he never heard of.
I said 10/10 Canadiana.
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Re: VETO?

Post by MacSR » Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:43 pm

We've hosted the last couple of VETOs at McMaster. I think we'd be open to hosting a summer tournament again this year. Doesn't have to be VETO, but it could be.

Hamilton isn't Toronto, but it's a short bus ride away.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Kyle » Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:53 pm

Wasn't it true in the old days that the Vancouver winner and the Toronto winner played each other at the end of the tournament? How did that work?

I might be able to get people somewhere in England interested in a light-hearted-but-still-well-written not-very-American packet-submission tournament in August if you want to collaborate.

We have an awful lot of alumni plus a remarkably dedicated pool of adult "quizzzing" enthusiasts. One of my greatest ambitions is to arrange an opportunity of some sort for the latter to get beaten by Jerry, hence why I ask about the tradition of the multi-site showdown.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Mike Bentley » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:03 am

It was my impression that Peter et al didn't want another edited tournament even it was offered, although I could be mistaken. For what it's worth, a contingent of Seattle people would probably be writing at least 2 packets for this tournament, so it wouldn't all be standard VETO fare.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Bartleby » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:14 am

Kyle wrote:Wasn't it true in the old days that the Vancouver winner and the Toronto winner played each other at the end of the tournament? How did that work?

I might be able to get people somewhere in England interested in a light-hearted-but-still-well-written not-very-American packet-submission tournament in August if you want to collaborate.

We have an awful lot of alumni plus a remarkably dedicated pool of adult "quizzzing" enthusiasts. One of my greatest ambitions is to arrange an opportunity of some sort for the latter to get beaten by Jerry, hence why I ask about the tradition of the multi-site showdown.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Masked Canadian History Bandit » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:15 am

Depending on the date, I think Lisgar teams would be interested. We did go to ANGST after all.
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Re: VETO?

Post by the third garrideb » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:22 am

Yes, I was also wondering whether we'd be having ANGST/VETO up here this summer. I would certainly be interested and will contribute towards a packet if this happens.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Skepticism and Animal Feed » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:26 am

Kyle, what are potential locations in England for a big tournament? Oxford seems pretty inconvenient and expensive to get to from America, but I'd like to play an event on the other side of the Atlantic one day.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Important Bird Area » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:28 am

Once you've decided to go to England for a tournament, getting to Oxford is not really a problem at all.

Edit: does anyone want to mirror CO 2013 in Britain? I could be convinced to play, on the suspicion that it would be more fun than writing the history for the playoffs of CO 2007 in Britain was.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Bartleby » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:31 am

Were some sort of VETO or ANGST set to materialize, I could try to contribute to a pack, depending on the date. Also, I would love to see either TERD or CULT II (whichever is completed for Chicago Open) mirrored up here in the summer as well.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Kyle » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:33 am

Morraine Man wrote:Kyle, what are potential locations in England for a big tournament? Oxford seems pretty inconvenient and expensive to get to from America, but I'd like to play an event on the other side of the Atlantic one day.
Oxford isn't any more expensive than London to get to from the US. You just take a bus or a train. It's only an hour away from London anyway. And Oxford's accommodations would be far cheaper than London's because you could stay with me.

But Oxford is inconvenient from other parts of England, plus it's pretty dead in the summer. I suppose the likely possibilities would be Oxford, Manchester, or London.

I do want to host a packet-submission open tournament in England that draws a few American players at some point. Perhaps summer is not the most convenient time to do this.
Does anyone want to mirror CO 2013 in Britain? I could be convinced to play, on the suspicion that it would be more fun than writing the history for the playoffs of CO 2007 in Britain was.
I like that we're planning this far in advance, presumably on the assumption that it would take at least two more years for any team in England to become good enough to appreciate Chicago Open's particular perspective on question difficulty.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Skepticism and Animal Feed » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:37 am

My suspicion is that British quizbowl wouldn't be quite ready for Chicago Open. But perhaps, if a VETO/ANGST set is played in Canada and the United States in August, and is decently easy, it could be mirrored in England later in the fall?
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Re: VETO?

Post by Important Bird Area » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:40 am

Kyle wrote:I like that we're planning this far in advance, presumably on the assumption that it would take at least two more years for any team in England to become good enough to appreciate Chicago Open's particular perspective on question difficulty.
Less "long-term plan for the development of the British circuit," more "my next research trip to London will certainly not take place during the :capybara: Olympics."
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Re: VETO?

Post by Kyle » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:46 am

Morraine Man wrote:My suspicion is that British quizbowl wouldn't be quite ready for Chicago Open. But perhaps, if a VETO/ANGST set is played in Canada and the United States in August, and is decently easy, it could be mirrored in England later in the fall?
Well, the only reason I thought to post in the VETO thread (apologies for taking it over) was that I've heard Canadians in England complain about how VETO -- Jerry's year aside -- was their one annual respite from the all-consuming Americanness of quizbowl. Hence, if there was interest in VETO but no one jumping forward to coordinate it, there would probably be British people willing to help produce a Transatlantic tournament that was both good and not overtly American. But I don't think VETO in its usual form would go over all that well in the UK, given that British people know Canadiana even less than Americans (I know because one of my teammates decided that it would be a good idea to write a bonus starting "name these Canadian painters"; it was duly zeroed).

Anyway, Bruce, my promise to you from a few months ago still stands: if you can get two teams of Americans willing to participate in a regular-difficulty, packet-submission open tournament in the UK, no matter when it is convenient for you to play in it, I will edit it.

EDIT: Also, if you mean September, yes, that would be a good time for a "summer" tournament because Oxford doesn't start until October. The only thing is that I had sort of vague plans to go to Algeria at some point and I'm not sure when that would happen.
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Re: VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:05 am

Bentley Like Beckham wrote:It was my impression that Peter et al didn't want another edited tournament even it was offered, although I could be mistaken. For what it's worth, a contingent of Seattle people would probably be writing at least 2 packets for this tournament, so it wouldn't all be standard VETO fare.
I mean, who cares what Peter wants? I don't care if it's called VETO or something else, I'm just looking (and willing to write) for a summer tournament in Canada.
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Re: VETO?

Post by women, fire and dangerous things » Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:00 am

I'd write a packet for such a tournament.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Not That Kind of Christian!! » Sat Apr 23, 2011 10:09 am

Working on VETO last time was kind of fun. I'd be willing to edit some bio and/or music for this.
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Re: VETO?

Post by sds » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:15 pm

There are at least a few of us from Michigan who would play a summer tournament in Canada. NGST was a surprisingly good time.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Quantum Mushroom Billiard Hat » Sat Apr 23, 2011 2:18 pm

I'd play some sequel to NGST as well.
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Re: VETO?

Post by MacSR » Sat Apr 23, 2011 2:29 pm

Whatever it may be, I think we'd be willing to give it a home @ Mac. We are working on our late August trash tournament, but we might be open to hosting other trash tournaments as well.
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Re: VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Sat Apr 23, 2011 6:11 pm

MacSR wrote:Whatever it may be, I think we'd be willing to give it a home @ Mac. We are working on our late August trash tournament, but we might be open to hosting other trash tournaments as well.
I think what we're talking about is not a trash tournament at all but rather an academic tournament.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Bartleby » Sat Apr 23, 2011 6:51 pm

grapesmoker wrote:
MacSR wrote:Whatever it may be, I think we'd be willing to give it a home @ Mac. We are working on our late August trash tournament, but we might be open to hosting other trash tournaments as well.
I think what we're talking about is not a trash tournament at all but rather an academic tournament.
There was no McMaster team at the first ANGST (or NGST, as I guess the "A" has logically been dropped), so perhaps there's just confusion over what the tournament actually was. Suffice it to say, McMaster hosts a lot of tournaments, and I don't think they'd be averse to hosting this one just because it wasn't a trash tournament.
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Re: VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Sat Apr 23, 2011 7:35 pm

Bartleby wrote:There was no McMaster team at the first ANGST (or NGST, as I guess the "A" has logically been dropped), so perhaps there's just confusion over what the tournament actually was. Suffice it to say, McMaster hosts a lot of tournaments, and I don't think they'd be averse to hosting this one just because it wasn't a trash tournament.
Sure. I just want to be clear on what the conversation is about. I think a tournament at McMaster would be a fine idea.
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Re: VETO?

Post by MacSR » Sat Apr 23, 2011 7:51 pm

Yup I'm aware that we're talking about an academic tournament. For the past couple of years we've hosted two tournaments in the summer, VETO and our packet-sub trash tournament.

I haven't checked with the rest of the club that is around for the summer, but I don't think we'd be averse to possibly adding another tournament to our docket.

And I don't think we're too attached to VETO at Mac. If more people want to play a different tournament (which might be the case), we'd be down to host that one instead.

We'll see what happens over the course of the summer I guess.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Bartleby » Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:46 pm

A suggestion might be to turn the two events into one weekend?
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Re: VETO?

Post by tiwonge » Sun Apr 24, 2011 6:18 pm

Paul Smith will be visiting me over the summer, and we're both interested in going to Canada to play. We'd be willing to write a packet together.
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Re: VETO?

Post by MicroEStudent » Sun Apr 24, 2011 9:38 pm

I'm sure I could get some people to play, especially if it's at McMaster because, for selfish reasons, it would be something we wouldn't have to stay the night for.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Gautam » Sun Apr 24, 2011 10:37 pm

I want to write more "regular difficulty" questions, so I'd be happy to write a packet for this tournament, if it happens, even though I won't be able to play it.

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Re: VETO?

Post by bmcke » Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:09 pm

Seems like a lot of experienced writers have pledged packets for this non-tournament, plus at least two of them offered to edit categories. If this happens, I'm curious about what distribution would look like.

[Edited to retract offer of subject editing. Probably not a good idea, now that I think about it.]
Last edited by bmcke on Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: VETO?

Post by tiwonge » Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:52 pm

I suspect that if it were edited, it would cease to be VETO. It might become ANGST or something similar.

(Edited to add: and probably wouldn't get played in Vancouver, but probably might still get played in Toronto, which was what prompted this thread.)
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Re: VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:04 am

bmcke wrote:Seems like a lot of experienced writers have pledged packets for this non-tournament, plus at least two of them offered to edit categories. If this happens, I'm curious about what distribution would look like.
Standard ACF distribution, I would think. Except perhaps more Canadian content.
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Re: VETO?

Post by tiwonge » Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:08 am

grapesmoker wrote:
bmcke wrote:Seems like a lot of experienced writers have pledged packets for this non-tournament, plus at least two of them offered to edit categories. If this happens, I'm curious about what distribution would look like.
Standard ACF distribution, I would think. Except perhaps more Canadian content.
And gobstoppers.
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Re: VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:10 am

tiwonge wrote:And gobstoppers.
Handed out for consumption at the start of the tournament.
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Re: VETO?

Post by theMoMA » Mon Apr 25, 2011 9:45 am

grapesmoker wrote:but if I have to pick up a gobstopper, things will get hairy.
The google image results for "gobstopper in beard" are surprisingly disappointing. Though they did produce this gem.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Cheynem » Thu Apr 28, 2011 4:28 pm

So, er, does anyone want to take the reins on this? I see some people saying they'd write and some people, including me, saying they'd edit, but it would be great to see someone claiming this project (perhaps even a Canadian?) and be able to announce things more confidently.
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Re: VETO?

Post by MacSR » Sat Apr 30, 2011 12:34 am

Have people dropped this idea in favour of the BLASTOISE mirror/side events?

If not, and people would still like to do this tournament, Mac is still willing to host.
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Re: VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Sat Apr 30, 2011 12:44 am

MacSR wrote:Have people dropped this idea in favour of the BLASTOISE mirror/side events?

If not, and people would still like to do this tournament, Mac is still willing to host.
I don't think so, the BLASTOISE thing, whatever it ends up being, appears to be independent. If people are still willing to edit a VETO, presumably those of us interested in going are still willing to write for it.
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Re: VETO?

Post by tiwonge » Sat Apr 30, 2011 1:01 am

What is BLASTOISE?
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Re: VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Sat Apr 30, 2011 1:03 am

tiwonge wrote:What is BLASTOISE?
It's a hybrid trash/academic thing written by some high schoolers.
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Re: VETO?

Post by ryandillon » Sat Apr 30, 2011 10:57 pm

Pending interest/parents a DCC contingent could be interested.
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Re: VETO?

Post by MacSR » Sat May 07, 2011 1:48 am

In the BLASTOISE thread, there was some talk of a Moon Pie+FOGHAT mirror up here in Canada...

Would people rather travel for that, or would they still like to see the new tournament written instead of VETO?

Either way we should be able to host.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Windows ME » Sat May 07, 2011 7:06 pm

I obviously don't speak for everyone else but if you host ANYTHING that's more or less purely academic it would probably satisfy/elate this entire thread (and myself =D)
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Re: VETO?

Post by vetovian » Mon May 09, 2011 3:20 am

VETO will be in Vancouver on Saturday, July 23.
http://caql.org/events/veto11.html
We don't have a site confirmed yet, but we're going to try to get Harbour Centre again.

It'll be run in the traditional VETO guerrilla format, with no central editing. This is not everyone's cup of tea, but it is the preference of the long-time regular VETO participants.

If anyone can offer a mirror site in Ontario, contact me.

Thanks to Mike Bentley for referring me to this discussion.
Kyle wrote: Wasn't it true in the old days that the Vancouver winner and the Toronto winner played each other at the end of the tournament? How did that work?
Go to the CAQL results page and click on one of the links labelled "Trans-Canada Championship Match". We had seven of them, the last one in 2007. For most of them, there is a downloadable audio recording that you can listen to.
Running a Trans-Canada Championship Match obviously requires additional logistical and technical complications, but I'm interested in having one again if possible.
Kyle wrote: I've heard Canadians in England complain about how VETO -- Jerry's year aside -- was their one annual respite from the all-consuming Americanness of quizbowl.
Who are these Canadian quiz bowlers in England? Other than Bruce Lin?
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Re: VETO?

Post by grapesmoker » Mon May 09, 2011 3:53 pm

Let me just be absolutely clear that despite the fact that this thread is titled "VETO?" I have no interest in playing anything that resembles a VETO from any year that isn't 2009. I'm just using "VETO" as metonymy for "some Canadian tournament." If anyone does decide to mirror the actual VETO, go nuts, but it'll be happening without my participation (and, I suspect and hope, without the participation of other American teams as well).
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Re: VETO?

Post by MacSR » Fri May 13, 2011 6:08 pm

I haven't talked to either school about mirroring them yet.... but would a Moon Pie+ FOGHAT Saturday-Sunday mirror sometime in late-June or July be of interest to this group?
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Re: VETO?

Post by minusfive » Fri May 13, 2011 10:48 pm

UToronto has the FOGHAT packets, and will be announcing a mirror for FOGHAT on June 18.
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Re: VETO?

Post by Bartleby » Fri May 13, 2011 11:50 pm

If U of T is indeed mirroring FOGHAT, I would propose the following:

We try to hold a Canadian open tournament (at McMaster?) during the first weekend of August, and that we either pair it with Jeff Goldblum, or, if it were possible, the COLT set being prepared for Chicago open.

(I say this, of course, not having the capability to marshal people together to create such a thing, nor the ability to provide any meaningful editing to this proposed tournament, were it indeed to occur)

EDIT: Changed date suggestion
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Re: VETO?

Post by MacSR » Sat May 14, 2011 5:59 pm

Bartleby wrote:If U of T is indeed mirroring FOGHAT, I would propose the following:

We try to hold a Canadian open tournament (at McMaster?) during the first weekend of August, and that we either pair it with Jeff Goldblum, or, if it were possible, the COLT set being prepared for Chicago open.

(I say this, of course, not having the capability to marshal people together to create such a thing, nor the ability to provide any meaningful editing to this proposed tournament, were it indeed to occur)

EDIT: Changed date suggestion
Hmm I like those ideas. Mac might travel to Chicago to play COLT, so we would be able to host a mirror here for sure.

So how I see it playing out right now would be: Mac hosting an academic open tournament or Moon Pie + COLT on a weekend in early August. We'd host Jeff Goldblum around its normal late August date.

How about that? Again...I'd still have to contact the other writers about mirroring their tournaments.
Sameer Rawal
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