The Quizbowl Resource Center

Good morning all...so I hear there's been quite the buzz out there about McMaster hosting ACF Fall, and me not posting anything just to be a huge dick. While it may be the case that I can sometimes be a huge dick, I can assure you that this was not the intention for this late announcement. Instead, I only just found out last night that we would be allowed to host the tournament, due to apparent communications snafus over the course of the month. Why should I make an announcement and book rooms for a tournament that, in reality, was not happening until yesterday? In any event, I apologize for any pantie-bunching that this late announcement may have caused, but nonetheless, here it is.

TENTATIVELY (awaiting final confirmation from the ACF deities) ACF Fall 2013 @McMaster Nov. 9, 2013

[This is now confirmed--the ACF deities]

[*]Packet submission dates for teams attending the McMaster site (as in, teams who normally would have been due to geography) will be pushed forward 1 week

This will TENTATIVELY run in either the McMaster University Student Centre or some building in close proximity (http://www.mcmaster.ca/welcome/campusmap.cfm), and the original announcement for ACF Fall 2013 with all other pertinent information is here (viewtopic.php?f=8&t=14595).

Teams wishing to sign up, and/or ask any questions specific to this event, are encouraged to email BOTH [email protected], and [email protected]. I'm not actually an official exec member of our club, so things run a little differently round these parts now.

Anyways, hope to see you all here!

PS: The sooner we know which teams will be attending, the easier it will be to set up the tournament logistically, and ensure that every team has a spot!

Senator_Jay wrote:[*]Packet submission dates for teams attending the McMaster site (as in, teams who normally would have been due to geography) will be pushed forward 1 week

Is this supposed to mean, for instance, that the Oct. 6 no penalty deadline becomes Sept. 29 or Oct. 13?

Oct 13, from my understanding. Again, still awaiting final confirmation.

If you don't mind me asking, will "undergraduate" or "Div II" teams be specially recognized at the tournament? This might influence our team-building for the tournament.

No sweat about the delayed announcement, which, it seems rather plainly to me, was not an error on the part of McMaster University's club. Speaking on behalf of Waterloo, we acted on the assumption that ACF Fall would certainly happen /somewhere/ in Ontario and hence proceeded with our writing like responsible people. Everyone should try to be more like me, really.

There will be n >= 1 team from Buffalo, though I cannot attend personally.

odin_envy_me wrote:If you don't mind me asking, will "undergraduate" or "Div II" teams be specially recognized at the tournament? This might influence our team-building for the tournament.

I think that will depend upon how many and which teams we get signing up. Likely it'll just be free-for-all, as in years past; at most DI and DII in the same field (but with a prize going to top DII).

Here are ACF's rules on this:

Trophies: The top two overall teams will receive trophies in all cases. If the host reasonably expects fewer than four undergraduate and/or four Division II teams to play the tournament two weeks before the tournament, when the trophies are ordered, then the host must inform ACF that it will opt out of Undergraduate and/or Division II trophies. If the host receives Undergraduate and/or Division II trophies, or if there are four or more teams that qualify, the Undergraduate and/or Division II titles must be awarded.

Prizes: At a minimum, the members of the top two overall teams, and the top four individual scorers, should receive book prizes. Used books that you can acquire for a few dollars each are perfectly acceptable. For tournaments of ten or more teams, it is strongly preferred that you also give book prizes to the next four overall scorers and to the top four undergraduate and Division II scorers. If the host opts out of Undergraduate and/or Division II trophies, but it turns out that there are enough teams to award either or both of those titles, hosts must award the titles and make reasonable efforts to award prizes to the winners.

In addition to emailing Jay and the McMaster team, schools wishing to register for this tournament must fill out this form.

Susan wrote:In addition to emailing Jay and the McMaster team, schools wishing to register for this tournament must fill out this form.

Does this mean the tournament details are no longer tentative?

Yes--McMaster is indeed confirmed as a host. I will edit the thread title and initial post to make that clear, and I'll also add this site to the list of sites in the global announcement.

Well, Ottawa will be sending at least 1 team. We're also the only team signed up via the form, so...

Also, very excited to hear about prizes (McMaster's prizes are always a high-calibre[Canadian spelling, Yanks] of awesome, not to disparage the awesome and entertaining prize I won last year).

On the record, (and given that Ottawa's pack is completed and will be submitted before this site's no-penalty deadline tomorrow), I would highly encourage ACF to allow teams that would normally be required to write a pack to play without writing a pack for this specific tournament (limited to ONLY this tournament), perhaps with an additional penalty (although the lack of discounts is in itself a type of penalty), for the following contextual reasons:

1) There are numerous packets already at the writing/editing team's disposal (well over 20 if my cursory math holds). There is no more need for additional packets, which may not even be used.
2) While not writing is of course not to be encouraged, in this case teams which have no intention of writing will be able to attend, thus increasing both field competitiveness and money to both the hosts and ACF.
3) Teams that enjoy themselves are more likely to come back than teams are to suddenly develop the urge to write questions. Allowing Canadian teams to attend ACF Fall would thus be a sort of "thin edge of the wedge" for a region that desperately needs quizbowl-building.
4) To NOT do this would result in less utility for everyone and would, respectfully, privilege doctrine over a higher-efficiency alternative. I am notably NOT recommending this for other regions or for any other tournaments. It's just a question of maximizing attendance.

Anyway, that's my 2 Canadian cents for the day. Also, Happy (Canadian) Thanksgiving!!!

The list of teams registered with ACF for this tournament can be found here. If you haven't yet registered for this tournament, please do so using this form.

minusfive wrote:On the record, (and given that Ottawa's pack is completed and will be submitted before this site's no-penalty deadline tomorrow), I would highly encourage ACF to allow teams that would normally be required to write a pack to play without writing a pack for this specific tournament (limited to ONLY this tournament), perhaps with an additional penalty (although the lack of discounts is in itself a type of penalty), for the following contextual reasons:

1) There are numerous packets already at the writing/editing team's disposal (well over 20 if my cursory math holds). There is no more need for additional packets, which may not even be used.
2) While not writing is of course not to be encouraged, in this case teams which have no intention of writing will be able to attend, thus increasing both field competitiveness and money to both the hosts and ACF.
3) Teams that enjoy themselves are more likely to come back than teams are to suddenly develop the urge to write questions. Allowing Canadian teams to attend ACF Fall would thus be a sort of "thin edge of the wedge" for a region that desperately needs quizbowl-building.
4) To NOT do this would result in less utility for everyone and would, respectfully, privilege doctrine over a higher-efficiency alternative. I am notably NOT recommending this for other regions or for any other tournaments. It's just a question of maximizing attendance.

^This. Guelph would love to send a team, but past experiences with ACF tournaments have us hesitant to submit a pack. Many times, we have worked very hard to submit packets, only to find them go completely unused. So we are now not particularly interested in submitting for ACF tournaments, knowing that our efforts will likely be in vain. Since attendance is often low at Canadian tournaments (especially this one, if the list of registered teams is accurate), I ask that we should be allowed to attend without submitting a pack, and are willing to accept any necessary penalties for this to happen.

I will be there to moderate in some capacity, whether it is affiliated with Toronto or as an independent.

Thanks Aaron, always appreciated.

Tom, Jordan--I'm afraid we won't be making any changes to the packet submission requirements this late in the game, but we've heard your comments and ACF will discuss them as we think about how to run Fall next year. Thanks for your feedback.

Just as an update, uWaterloo is working on getting her newer players organized and will certainly be sending at least one more team to this. Apologies for the delayed registration.

Just to confirm, Carleton is sending one team to this.

odin_envy_me wrote:Just as an update, uWaterloo is working on getting her newer players organized and will certainly be sending at least one more team to this. Apologies for the delayed registration.

Can now confirm that this is exactly one more team. So two Waterloo teams in total, one D1 and one D2.

The field as it stands is as follows:
1) Buffalo
2) Carleton
3) Ottawa
4) Waterloo A
5) Waterloo B
6) Toronto
7) Western
8) McMaster

As with the trash tournament last month, we will be meeting in front of Room 203 in the McMaster University Student Centre (MUSC). Given the lengthiness of this tournament, we'd like to start at 9am, which means that teams should be arriving around 8:30-8:45am. Yes, we will try to actually start on time.

Another reminder: I still have not found the owner of a grey hoodie left behind at STP Trash. Let me know if it's yours!

It doesn't look like all the teams are registered via the official registration system (though it does lag a little before displaying newly registered teams). So this is friendly reminder that any team that hasn't already registered via the (edit: form, not spreadsheet) at

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1PLoMzG ... o/viewform

should do so ASAP.

adosreme wrote:It doesn't look like all the teams are registered via the official registration system (though it does lag a little before displaying newly registered teams). So this is friendly reminder that any team that hasn't already registered via the spreadsheet at

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1PLoMzG ... o/viewform

should do so ASAP.

In this case, it seems that 'a little' is actually several days - all teams have already registered via the form, so we're just waiting for them to show up at the moment.

All teams should now be showing up on the spreadsheet.

O Fortuna wrote:

adosreme wrote:It doesn't look like all the teams are registered via the official registration system (though it does lag a little before displaying newly registered teams). So this is friendly reminder that any team that hasn't already registered via the spreadsheet at

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1PLoMzG ... o/viewform

should do so ASAP.

In this case, it seems that 'a little' is actually several days - all teams have already registered via the form, so we're just waiting for them to show up at the moment.

Excellent. I just didn't want any team to miss out because they forgot to officially sign up.

Speaking of signups...can I get a tally of how many staff are being offered by teams? We can field a few, but I'm expecting a couple from attending teams (if at all possible!).

For any teams that may be arriving late, please note that we will be in KTH (Kenneth Taylor Hall), the building on the right-hand side of the arts quad, behind the student centre (see 38 on the campus map here).

Preliminary stats are here; combined (prelims + playoffs) are here.

Thanks to Mac for running this smoothly today!

It should be noted that Carleton finished 4th, as they were in the top bracket. Waterloo won the D2/UG crowns - note to the ACF deities that the individual that rendered them ineligible for those prizes (when they were registering) was unable to attend at the last moment, and so they were actually D2 eligible.

EDIT: Stats note - there's no tossups heard showing right now for the Waterloo A - McMaster game.

cruzeiro wrote:Thanks to Mac for running this smoothly today!

It should be noted that Carleton finished 4th, as they were in the top bracket. Waterloo won the D2/UG crowns - note to the ACF deities that the individual that rendered them ineligible for those prizes (when they were registering) was unable to attend at the last moment, and so they were actually D2 eligible.

EDIT: Stats note - there's no tossups heard showing right now for the Waterloo A - McMaster game.

That person was me, and I can confirm that I was not in attendance today, having been in a car accident yesterday evening.

cruzeiro wrote: EDIT: Stats note - there's no tossups heard showing right now for the Waterloo A - McMaster game.

The missing TUH should now be corrected.

Many thanks to Jay, Leslie, and all of McMaster for hosting this tournament and having it run smoothly!

I must say that must be one of the best if not the best improvised tournament I have ever been to, in my insignificant amount of tournaments attended.

For a power: Name this country that was formed on February 14, 1854, home originally to the Tswana people, and though it was considered a politically and economically successful republic, was the scene of repeated and persistent conflicts. No searching!

TheRhymeMinister wrote:Many thanks to Jay, Leslie, and all of McMaster for hosting this tournament and having it run smoothly!

I would also like to say a big thank you to Leslie, Jay and all of the other organizers/staff (including Rico Catibog!) who made this tournament both smooth and fun. Also, thank you to the people who came to play, especially the trophy-bearers Buffalo! Very nice playing with you all.

Peter13 wrote:For a power: Name this country that was formed on February 14, 1854, home originally to the Tswana people, and though it was considered a politically and economically successful republic, was the scene of repeated and persistent conflicts. No searching!

The Orange Free State was founded on February 17th, dude, not Valentine's Day (one could also argue February 23). Also, the weasel-worded body text is directly lifted from wikipedia. And it's disingenuous to say that it was "home" to the Tswana, who had no representation or desire (for the most part) to be part of this regime.

Yup, yup, yup! Quick thank you to everyone at Mac for hosting this and I reiterate my claim that out of the now 15-odd tournaments I've attended, this might have been the one that run most smoothly. All credit goes to Waterloo, of course. And none for Jay Misuk, bye.

Thanks to Leslie, Aaron, Rico and the other readers, to Buffalo for ferrying trophies, to Nick Penner and Dennis Beeby for the personal favour of driving Waterloo's fabulous asses down there, to Shelby "Sassypants" Ro-bair for being a flawless carrot-providing DJ, and to literally everyone else there that did not annoy me.

And let it be recorded that Shelby Robert is dead to me #Cadmus

Let's keep any further discussion in this thread on-topic, please. I've moved the random trivia question discussion to the Forbidden Zone.