The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

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The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

Aww, Horseapples!

Nationals are coming up, so let's stand by the ol' cracker barrel and ask each other "what's the frequency, Kenneth?"

I swear, we've got a real chance this year. I may be an ol' country boozer, but John Barleycorn can' take away all of my grey matter. Stephen's been doing his science real well, I can say. Jacob's been baroque, tho he can still pick up a tab for a friend in need in occasion. An' for Adam's, it's always so easy. I've been easy a time or too, but not like Adam has. They've all been worked like government mules by my bad manners an' delinquent habits but they've remained smiling.

A fellow a worked with once said "Mexican coffee is good... if you like dirt!" Same for the other teams. I'm joking y'all. I do swear, though, that if we win ICT, I'm getting a fresh tattoo near my goat in commemoration.

What do you folks say?
Last edited by The Stately Rhododendron on Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

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I thought AHAN was closed
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Cheynem »

This is the year when Jordan spears Matt Bollinger five times and says "it's my yard now."
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Auks Ran Ova »

The Stately Rhododendron wrote:What do you folks say?
"What the hell are you talking about?"
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

Auks Ran Ova wrote:
The Stately Rhododendron wrote:What do you folks say?
"What the hell are you talking about?"
Y'all know if this had been published by The Baffler Rob would have shared it without a question.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Auks Ran Ova »

The Stately Rhododendron wrote:
Auks Ran Ova wrote:
The Stately Rhododendron wrote:What do you folks say?
"What the hell are you talking about?"
Y'all know if this had been published by The Baffler Rob would have shared it without a question.
No, they've posted incoherent nonsense too
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

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Delaware will probably do poorly because Rohan and I have been busy with school stuff and not studying. Fortunately, no one cares about DII.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Everything in the Whole Wide World »

Tornrak wrote:Delaware will probably do poorly
Sigh, guess the boosters need to be funneling more money under the table.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Off To See The Lizard »

NYU is willing to take bribes to perform as badly as you want us to.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by naan/steak-holding toll »

Predicted ICT Top 4 order of finish:

4) Chicago - Overloaded on Coke, Max beats Auroni to a buzzer race on a tossup on the gallbladder and unintentionally blurts out "bladder," thinking mainly of himself. Even without Chris Ray, an organ tossup proves to be the bane of Chicago.
3) Michigan
2) Yale - Going into the last tossup of a play-in game against Michigan, Yale is down by 35. Yale powers the tossup and they get a social science bonus. They pull the first two parts, and the easy part is Margaret Mead, which leaves Isaac severely tilted for the final.
1) Maryland - A tilted Isaac proceeds to drop current events to Weijia, after which the finals game quickly spirals out of control.

Going beyond this would be to trust in ICT seeding, which experience tells me not to do.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by vinteuil »

michigan wins but jordan gets the snitch
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by wcheng »

vinteuil wrote:michigan wins but jordan gets the snitch
A, B, C, easy as 1, 2, 3...
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by 1.82 »

Serious prediction: Maryland will be the only school in the top bracket of ICT without a top-14 law school.
wcheng wrote:
vinteuil wrote:michigan wins but jordan gets the snitch
A, B, C, easy as 1, 2, 3...
I still have the power to get you kicked out of Maryland quizbowl, you know.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

Who will watch my home place, I wonder, as I think of being away from my sourdough starter for a weekend?

I'll be standing by this cracker barrel the whole weekend, ready for conversatin' and sharing the dee-stinct observations that come.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by heterodyne »

The Stately Rhododendron wrote:Who will watch my home place, I wonder, as I think of being away from my sourdough starter for a weekend?

I'll be standing by this cracker barrel the whole weekend, ready for conversatin' and sharing the dee-stinct observations that come.
why are you like this
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

heterodyne wrote:
The Stately Rhododendron wrote:Who will watch my home place, I wonder, as I think of being away from my sourdough starter for a weekend?

I'll be standing by this cracker barrel the whole weekend, ready for conversatin' and sharing the dee-stinct observations that come.
why are you like this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ksm12TMdrIY
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Rococo A Go Go »

The Stately Rhododendron wrote:Who will watch my home place, I wonder, as I think of being away from my sourdough starter for a weekend?

I'll be standing by this cracker barrel the whole weekend, ready for conversatin' and sharing the dee-stinct observations that come.
I'm going to call Yale and tell them you're doing a cultural appropriation.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by heterodyne »

Rococo A Go Go wrote:
The Stately Rhododendron wrote:Who will watch my home place, I wonder, as I think of being away from my sourdough starter for a weekend?

I'll be standing by this cracker barrel the whole weekend, ready for conversatin' and sharing the dee-stinct observations that come.
I'm going to call Yale and tell them you're doing a cultural appropriation.
Hey, I'm sure that Hillbilly Elegy like, really changed the way he looks at things
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by vinteuil »

heterodyne wrote:
Rococo A Go Go wrote:
The Stately Rhododendron wrote:Who will watch my home place, I wonder, as I think of being away from my sourdough starter for a weekend?

I'll be standing by this cracker barrel the whole weekend, ready for conversatin' and sharing the dee-stinct observations that come.
I'm going to call Yale and tell them you're doing a cultural appropriation.
Hey, I'm sure that Hillbilly Elegy like, really changed the way he looks at things
vicious
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by AKKOLADE »

cracker barrel is ok
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by ryanrosenberg »

AKKOLADE wrote:cracker barrel is ok
lies
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by AKKOLADE »

It's really all right food. It's not anything special, but if your main priority is getting something that isn't deep fried and is unlikely to make you vomit on the last four hours of your car ride home, it's fine.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by John Ketzkorn »

Granny Soberer wrote:
AKKOLADE wrote:cracker barrel is ok
lies
It's been all down hill since they fired Brad's wife.

I'd give my thoughts about DII, but
Tornrak wrote: no one cares about DII.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

Ran into nyu. They called me Jesus. I said I'm no false prophet. They said I'm just the messiah. I have to disagree but Jacob sez I'm the naqt messiah.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Ciorwrong »

John Ketzkorn wrote:I'd give my thoughts about DII, but
Tornrak wrote:no one cares about DII.
We have a DII team going to this and I plan on staffing. Illinois seems like the DII favorite right? Ohio State also has a really strong DII team.

I'd just like to learn more about this DII event because we know who are the favorites in DI are.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by John Ketzkorn »

Progcon wrote: We have a DII team going to this and I plan on staffing. Illinois seems like the DII favorite right? Ohio State also has a really strong DII team.

I'd just like to learn more about this DII event because we know who are the favorites in DI are.
While the D-value isn't perfect, I think it gives a decent idea of team strength.

That being said, Berkeley D has a really high ppb and shouldn't be discounted.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

Cilantro or Giordanos the debate rages as we walk on the river road. Meanwhile me and youseff agree Cracker Barrel have mediocre biscuits and somewhere in Tennessee Vanderbilt is boarding a long Greyhound, with many miles to go.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

Bananas are intermediate sugars, sez Adam. Adam has 2 bananas, one for 930, one for 11, he says.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by AKKOLADE »

mods, please don't move this to the best of the best subforum
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

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But what's this? A premature banana! "Yeah, my banana timing is off," he admits.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by vinteuil »

yes we have no bananas
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

First half was a little rough, I think. Could have done better, but I've learned not to focus on the could have.

Went for a run in the scrubby bush around here. Went into a burned over field. Full focus. Back on it.

Me and Rob had a talk. We're DSA comrades, don't take his attacks on my posing too seriously.

Passed a USAF guy going back to the hotel. He sez "get some miles for the both of us." I don't serve a fascist empire, sorry sir no sir.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by MorganV »

Can Dylan do better than his NCAA team did??
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

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MorganV wrote:Can Dylan do better than his NCAA team did??
From just a cursory look at the online stats, it seems Northwestern is doing quite well.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

Played like mud in the prelims played like gold in the playoffs but it wasn't enough. Disappointment

I tell Andrew Hart he's a man of many talents. He sez he's good at throwing things. That's a talent for sure.

Michigan vs northwestern. Looks like a FUN final.

Dan Puma sez I "Look like I'm following a Florida Georgia line tour"

I know when I'm got.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by dhumphreys17 »

Anyone else find it odd that only one team in both Division I and II converted over 20 PPB for ICT, and neither of those teams had over 21 PPB? I don't know if anyone from NAQT reads this part of the forum, but if they do: does NAQT have any intention of adjusting its bonus difficulty, or is ~20 PPB for the top team the target?
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Cody »

dhumphreys17 wrote:Anyone else find it odd that only one team in both Division I and II converted over 20 PPB for ICT, and neither of those teams had over 21 PPB? I don't know if anyone from NAQT reads this part of the forum, but if they do: does NAQT have any intention of adjusting its bonus difficulty, or is ~20 PPB for the top team the target?
It's only odd if you don't know anything about college national tournaments.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by naan/steak-holding toll »

dhumphreys17 wrote:Anyone else find it odd that only one team in both Division I and II converted over 20 PPB for ICT, and neither of those teams had over 21 PPB? I don't know if anyone from NAQT reads this part of the forum, but if they do: does NAQT have any intention of adjusting its bonus difficulty, or is ~20 PPB for the top team the target?
Yeah, honestly those bonus conversions look pretty normal for D1 ICT. D2 usually does have some higher numbers - it could be that this year's field was weak, that the set was tough, or both.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by John Ketzkorn »

Periplus of the Erythraean Sea wrote:
dhumphreys17 wrote:Anyone else find it odd that only one team in both Division I and II converted over 20 PPB for ICT, and neither of those teams had over 21 PPB? I don't know if anyone from NAQT reads this part of the forum, but if they do: does NAQT have any intention of adjusting its bonus difficulty, or is ~20 PPB for the top team the target?
Yeah, honestly those bonus conversions look pretty normal for D1 ICT. D2 usually does have some higher numbers - it could be that this year's field was weak, that the set was tough, or both.
I can confirm that Illinois sucks, and we 0'd several bonuses. We did not deserve much higher than 20ppb. Although, some of the bonuses (in stuff I have spent a fair amount of time studying) had impossible hard parts for a DII set.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by a named reaction »

John Ketzkorn wrote:
Periplus of the Erythraean Sea wrote:
dhumphreys17 wrote:Anyone else find it odd that only one team in both Division I and II converted over 20 PPB for ICT, and neither of those teams had over 21 PPB? I don't know if anyone from NAQT reads this part of the forum, but if they do: does NAQT have any intention of adjusting its bonus difficulty, or is ~20 PPB for the top team the target?
Yeah, honestly those bonus conversions look pretty normal for D1 ICT. D2 usually does have some higher numbers - it could be that this year's field was weak, that the set was tough, or both.
I can confirm that Illinois sucks, and we 0'd several bonuses. We did not deserve much higher than 20 ppb.
This applies to Delaware too, though I've never seen another iteration of this set and can't comment on the bonus difficulty.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Ciorwrong »

I watched some of DII ICT when my team was playing and I wasn't working on my high school set or whatever. I'd say most of the hard parts--particularly in science-- were not what you'd expect to have freshmen and sophomores in undergrad to know. Illinois, Delaware, Berkely C were clearly better than MSU's team and I'd expect the elite teams to get more than 20 ppb on this set given how many powers there were. Delaware powered like 7 tossups or something when they played MSU so they had deep knowledge of the answerlines but that knowledge was not always rewarded on the bonus. Often it seemed like there were two easy, regionals-level easy parts and then a hard part that was hard to see what they even wanted.

I'm not sure how we'd say if it was a weak field or not. Yes, some of the best freshmen and sophomores didn't play but isn't that what'd you expect given that they want their schools to qualify for D1 ICT? I think it's probably better for the sake of D2 if there is no superstar 100 ppg player playing or loaded team of standout sophomores that would annihilate the field. Most of the games I saw seemed pretty balanced to me and there were a lot of skilled players who got good buzzes. Maybe the way D2 eligibility works weakens the field, but I don't really have a problem with that.
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by dhumphreys17 »

Cody wrote:
dhumphreys17 wrote:Anyone else find it odd that only one team in both Division I and II converted over 20 PPB for ICT, and neither of those teams had over 21 PPB? I don't know if anyone from NAQT reads this part of the forum, but if they do: does NAQT have any intention of adjusting its bonus difficulty, or is ~20 PPB for the top team the target?
It's only odd if you don't know anything about college national tournaments.
I'm sorry, but from one who is admittedly an outsider looking in, it seems like the bonus conversion rate is much lower at the college level than at the high school level, and that simply seems odd. I understand, after further research, that this didn't suddenly become a thing (the 2016 ICT had no teams hit 20 PPB in D1, although 3 did in D2), but it still seems like the bonuses at ICT aren't necessarily following the 85%-50%-15% structure. Is there a different paradigm NAQT operates under for college, or is there a problem here?
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Cheynem »

The college nationals are usually harder than the high school nationals. I think what tends to happen is:

-the college nationals have a smaller field--it's harder to qualify or you're more self-selecting, so there's more emphasis on distinguishing between top teams rather than making sure very weak teams can get points

-the college game, especially at the top levels, is inherently harder than the high school game--typically, only the better players from HS play in college, and the distribution of potential question topics really opens up in college because of more exposure to potential topics.

-furthermore, college questions, especially at a nationals, are being produced by a smaller group of individuals than high school questions, so it's easier for an individual set to have some quirkier ideas regarding difficulty. ICT, being non packet submission, is perhaps the most susceptible to this.

I haven't seen the set; I would suspect it's about as difficult as other ICT's I've played...maybe even less so. For example, the 2011 ICT was won by my team with a BC of 18.35 (tied for highest). That's probably too difficult--although I don't recall the set being oppressively difficult, I think it's more that ICT (NAQT to an extent) was fond of throwing "got your nose" type bonuses at you where it was very easy to 0 as the baseline knowledge was more difficult than other categories (typically, I would guess in trash, CE, geography, and some social science). I think ICT has made efforts at correcting the difficulty issues (9 teams scored a conversion total of 17-20 this year, as opposed to 3 in 2011, for example), which is good.

Note that none of this is necessarily a justification for the difficulty--you could make the argument that high level college quizbowl is too hard and unforgiving, especially for the bottom bracket teams. On the other hand, I feel that college quizbowl is just harder...the greater answer space and tougher fields means it would be impractical for a HSNCT type thing where you have a lot of teams routinely over 20 ppb.
Mike Cheyne
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"You killed HSAPQ"--Matt Bollinger

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Ciorwrong
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Ciorwrong »

I think Devin's point is that given the natural distribution of bonuses, you'd expect a couple more teams over 20 ppb and a couple under 10. I understand that ICT is the hardest tournament but I've always felt that the bonuses at SCT were harder compared to ACF regionals as well. I think the existence of power also plays into it because averaging 20 ppb with a power every 4 tossups you get is like having a ppb of 22.5 on ACF rules.
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The Stately Rhododendron
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

Y'all are talking about numbers and all that. Maybe around an "e-barrel 2.0" but around the cracker barrel the only number that matters is tha number of eyes and ears you have. I've got a hangering for qualitative reports and home fried wit, and my throat is parched!
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Important Bird Area »

Progcon wrote:I watched some of DII ICT when my team was playing and I wasn't working on my high school set or whatever. I'd say most of the hard parts--particularly in science-- were not what you'd expect to have freshmen and sophomores in undergrad to know.
We now have a private discussion forum for ICT question content; specifics welcome over there.
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Sima Guang Hater
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Sima Guang Hater »

The Stately Rhododendron wrote:Y'all are talking about numbers and all that. Maybe around an "e-barrel 2.0" but around the cracker barrel the only number that matters is tha number of eyes and ears you have. I've got a hangering for qualitative reports and home fried wit, and my throat is parched!
Dude, seriously, learn when you're swinging and missing.
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The Stately Rhododendron
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by The Stately Rhododendron »

Hang down your head Tom Dooley it is not time for this thread to die!

Having "celebrated" and been "celebrated," hosting a Seder, a socialist meeting, eating my sauerkraut, life goes on. I have a "nosegay" in my shirt pocket right now and I'm smelling like success.

Questions questions questions! I have three questions:

How are others preparing for the weekend?
Got any gossip?
Have any difficult truths to share?

Back to "celebrating! "
IKD
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Cheynem
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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Cheynem »

Your post was insufficiently cracker barrel-y.
Mike Cheyne
Formerly U of Minnesota

"You killed HSAPQ"--Matt Bollinger

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Re: The ol' Nationals Cracker Barrel

Post by Banana Stand »

This 'ol Cracker Barrel is tumblin' on, but don' mind me, I'm just passin' by before I get to my there destination in the ol' Big Apple. Yessir, New York City for some good ol' fashioned bowlin'.

I'm hammered and I hope Jordan wins.
Jack Mehr
St. Joe's NJ '14
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