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NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 9:00 pm
by Jewish Pugilist
I am pleased to announce that a NASAT mirror will be occurring at Valencia College on August 19th, 2017. More information on NASAT can be found here (http://www.hsquizbowl.org/forums/viewto ... =2&t=19239). It will be an Open tournament so all players are eligible. Please be there by 9:15-9:30 as rounds will begin at 10 AM.

NASAT Fees
$90 per team
$5 buzzer discount
$10 Staffer discount
Minimum Fee: $50 per team

Super ACRONYM
A flat $50 fee per team

It's Lit
$10 per player

Payment and Registration: feel free to pay the day of with either cash or check to Chris Borglum or myself. I am adding a team registration sheet using Google Sheets so one member of the team can insert their team name, members of the team, discounts received, and any other pertinent information (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing)

Location: The usual building will be used, which is Building 9 at the Valencia West campus

Side Events Currently, Chris has planned for two side events to occur, Super ACRONYM (http://www.hsquizbowl.org/forums/viewto ... 19&t=19127) and It's Lit . Super Acronym, a trash tournament, will likely occur Friday, the 18th, at Valencia College starting around 4PM. The tossup only It's Lit (http://www.hsquizbowl.org/forums/viewto ... =8&t=18378) will be read after the conclusion of NASAT, likely around 6 PM.

Once we get a bit closer to the NASAT weekend, I will post the costs for the side events as well as field updates. Please feel free to email me if you have any questions at petertorres9@gmail.com

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:02 pm
by ValenciaQBowl
Here's a campus map for Valencia's West Campus (1800 South Kirkman Road, Orlando, 32810) for anyone who hasn't been before:
http://valenciacollege.edu/map/map-west.cfm

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:00 pm
by sonstige
Once y'all figure out when Super ACRONYM is being held, do post it. If it's really 4 PM on a Friday, I may be inclined to re-arrange my project schedule to staff this.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 1:55 pm
by adosreme
Is there a field cap? I'm interested in attending but still have to finalize things regarding teammates

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 4:06 pm
by quiz4life
Hi Chris,

For those teams/players needing lodging do you have suggestions on places that are near by to the campus?

Thanks,

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 4:38 pm
by Jewish Pugilist
adosreme wrote:Is there a field cap? I'm interested in attending but still have to finalize things regarding teammates
right now the field is capped at 20

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 5:53 pm
by sonstige
quiz4life wrote:Hi Chris,

For those teams/players needing lodging do you have suggestions on places that are near by to the campus?

Thanks,
Chris, in the past, has recommended such places as:

Motel 6 (5909 American Way, Orlando) or Hampton Inn (7110 S Kirkman Rd, Orlando)

Note that Valencia West is near Universal --- and we tend to have an abundance of lodging options in these parts being a major tourist hub and whatnot.

I can probably, maybe, even entertain a few people if they need a place to crash --- but we'll see.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:46 pm
by ValenciaQBowl
Thanks for replying, Travis. The two mentioned above are both good (and the Motel 6 is a good economy option). Closer still (not quite two miles away) is the Wingate, which has a hot breakfast: http://www.wingateorlando.com/#gref

Travis is correct that because our West Campus is only 3-4 miles from Universal, there are dozens of hotels within five miles of campus, fitting lots of different budgets, so if none of the three mentioned here are preferred, plenty more can be find by googling.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:01 am
by wd4gdz
Who will be the TD for the NASAT mirror?

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:23 am
by Jewish Pugilist
wd4gdz wrote:Who will be the TD for the NASAT mirror?
I will TD, since Chris is playing

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:28 am
by sonstige
But aren't you also playing?

I'm generally not a fan of TDs playing their own tournaments (nor, say, their roommates having such roles or vice versa) --- but am typically fine if Chris does it, since he's proven to have integrity and such.

I might be less inclined to participate in this event if an unaffiliated TD (or someone like Chris) isn't involved with at least question security.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:29 pm
by Charbroil
sonstige wrote:But aren't you also playing?

I'm generally not a fan of TDs playing their own tournaments (nor, say, their roommates having such roles or vice versa) --- but am typically fine if Chris does it, since he's proven to have integrity and such.

I might be less inclined to participate in this event if an unaffiliated TD (or someone like Chris) isn't involved with at least question security.
Do you really think that many TDs who play their own tournaments are untrustworthy? At the very least, do you think enough of them are untrustworthy that you would be "less inclined" to play an event if you know the TD is playing? That seems to be a rather uncharitable point of view.

I'm also not sure if your comment about people directing tournaments their roommates are playing makes a lot of sense. I know of lots of quiz bowl players who room together. Should I avoid all tournaments directed by people whose roommates are playing? Should I also investigate every tournament director at the events I play to make sure he/she isn't rooming with one of the players? Moreover, should I tell my teammates that if they're rooming with someone else on the team, they can't direct a tournament that their roommate(s) are playing? This seems to be the implication of your comment, but it also seems clearly excessive.

The way I see it, your comments make sense only if you believe that many--or even most--tournament directors will cheat if they have the chance. As a result, tournaments that don't have extensive measures to prevent such cheating are too risky to play. By extension, that seems to imply that many--or even most--quiz bowl players will cheat if they have the chance. This seems to be an unfair implication.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:37 pm
by bradleykirksey
The southeast has always worked on an honor system of sorts before, like all of the other circuits I'm sure. UCF had paper packets for the 2012 DII SCT and Mickey and Chas had extremely close ties to one of Valencia's players, and Valencia and that player didn't do any better than D values and previous performance indicated. The next year, Mickey read DII SCT and was dating Cass. Cass and Valencia B actually underperformed at CCCT. Cody, Peter, and I have combined to TD probably 10 tournaments where roommates and friends played and I think UCF's recent results at SCT and Regionals probably speak for themselves. NCF lost TTIAC when LEO TD'd and UF ran most of their A team and hosted and lost WAO. FSU lost ACF Fall, and I think UF winning EFT (expected, of course) is the only time a hosting team has won in our circuit for a few years.

You know Peter. He's a good kid, and he's gone to lengths to keep questions safe and everything for years, and we all know and like the guy. I think this looks like the start of a very silly witch hunt to me. There's no reason to start rumors like that, and boycotting a fun summer tournament because the guy contacting teams and handling payments is playing feels like a bad precedent to me.

With that said, Peter dropped his team anyways so that he could focus on TD-ing so that shouldn't be a problem.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:51 pm
by adosreme
bradleykirksey wrote:With that said, Peter dropped his team anyways so that he could focus on TD-ing so that shouldn't be a problem.
And with that, I'm guess that means I'm looking for people to play with. Is there a team that would be willing to take me in?

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:53 pm
by ValenciaQBowl
I agree with all the respondents to Travis, though I understand that he was, I think, generalizing to say that ideally a TD shouldn't play in a tournament (s)he is directing. I'm glad Peter's not playing now, not because I had any fears whatsoever about his integrity, but because he can focus better. But as was noted, I've organized and mostly directed tournaments in which I was playing, which usually just meant requesting rooms, making a schedule, and recruiting staff. Then someone else ran the staff room on the tournament day.

Anyway, for NASAT, Valencia co-coach Damion Hammock, who's not playing, will handle getting and printing the questions, as we can print for free at Valencia. He'll help Peter with on-site logistics and such. Peter will make the schedules (though I'll be willing to help) and run the staff room. All is well.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:54 pm
by ValenciaQBowl
I think I have a seat for you, Aaron, if you want to play with me and Stan Young (coach at Chipola College in Florida). But there are other options, too. Follow your bliss!

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 1:03 pm
by adosreme
ValenciaQBowl wrote:I think I have a seat for you, Aaron, if you want to play with me and Stan Young (coach at Chipola College in Florida). But there are other options, too. Follow your bliss!
Yes, I'd love to play on your team. Thank you very much!

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 1:11 pm
by LeoLaw
TDing a tournament was a stressful burden to my experience. If anyone is willing to take the burden to make the n-many teams who play to tournament happy, I don't think people with such pure intention would be cheating. Down here in the southeast we all know each other very well, it is hard to cheat when you have people like me and Cody who crunch the numbers from QB stats for fun.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 4:30 pm
by ValenciaQBowl
So it's now official that our third side event will be Auroni Gupta's excellent It's Lit, which we'll play an hour-ish after the NASAT mirror has concluded (maybe less if we all decide to chip in and order pizza). Players who think they're good at lit should probably play this as pairs, though trios and quartets will be acceptable among the many less-experienced players who may wish to play. Whatever, we'll figure it out.

Peter Torres will likely reply with a sign-up sheet. I've played this, so I'll run things. If you'd like to staff, let me know.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:41 pm
by wd4gdz
Just for the record, I definitely never thought Peter would cheat or anything like that. I was just wondering what would happen if, say, I was playing Peter's team, and there was a protest, how that would get resolved since he was the TD.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:56 pm
by sonstige
Charbroil wrote:
sonstige wrote:But aren't you also playing?

I'm generally not a fan of TDs playing their own tournaments (nor, say, their roommates having such roles or vice versa) --- but am typically fine if Chris does it, since he's proven to have integrity and such.

I might be less inclined to participate in this event if an unaffiliated TD (or someone like Chris) isn't involved with at least question security.
Do you really think that many TDs who play their own tournaments are untrustworthy? At the very least, do you think enough of them are untrustworthy that you would be "less inclined" to play an event if you know the TD is playing? That seems to be a rather uncharitable point of view.

I'm also not sure if your comment about people directing tournaments their roommates are playing makes a lot of sense. I know of lots of quiz bowl players who room together. Should I avoid all tournaments directed by people whose roommates are playing? Should I also investigate every tournament director at the events I play to make sure he/she isn't rooming with one of the players? Moreover, should I tell my teammates that if they're rooming with someone else on the team, they can't direct a tournament that their roommate(s) are playing? This seems to be the implication of your comment, but it also seems clearly excessive.

The way I see it, your comments make sense only if you believe that many--or even most--tournament directors will cheat if they have the chance. As a result, tournaments that don't have extensive measures to prevent such cheating are too risky to play. By extension, that seems to imply that many--or even most--quiz bowl players will cheat if they have the chance. This seems to be an unfair implication.
I'll entertain a response to this, since I somewhat invited it, eh? Keeping in mind, I was deliberately using non-committal verbiage while expressing what was, ultimately, just an opinion --- it's totally, 100% rad if you don't agree with it, nor does it necessarily need to make sense to you (sorry, man!). So let's not waste time over-analyzing personal preferences, because it's an absolutely pointless errand.

Said this way: my opinion that I'd ~generally~ prefer if a TD didn't play his/her own tournament is akin to why I ~generally~ refuse to eat mayonnaise. You may not agree with it, you may even think it's nonsensical, but ummm...so what? From my perspective, it is what it is.

Likewise, I'm ~generally~ not a huge fan of a TD's roommates playing an event that the TD is hosting (I mean, shouldn't they be staffing??!? /sarcasm). Can it be done? Sure. But I don't have to like it. The repeated emphasis here being on the word "generally." There are exceptions, especially if the affected individuals can demonstrate that any doubts regarding question or topic security are misplaced. In this case, I think Chris addressed things adequately.

With that: Bradley --- no one is starting some "silly witch hunt" here. I mean, should we be? Y'all haven't done anything against NAQT or ACF or whatever policy when hosting, right?

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:40 pm
by bradleykirksey
Billy, that's a good point I would have never thought about. Though I suspect that as long as the other team wasn't Chris, I think most people would just agree to have Chris resolve it. Either way, it's a moot point now, but if someone around here plays and TD's again, it might be better to reason that one out in advance.

Travis, that's fair. I don't like Mayo or trash tournaments very much, so I can appreciate that logic. With that said, I can't see any value in skipping a fun open summer tournament that should be well written with some good people around. If you want to skip it, it's a free country, even though I think you should try to play. But trying to set up rules like "People can't play tournaments that their roommates TD" is going to be awfully hard for some circuits. I think, though I could be wrong, that UF, NCF, and UCF all have roommates from the same program. More rules won't deter people who would cheat, though I don't think that Taylor, Peter, whoever's in charge of NCF at the moment, or Messick would do that.

I'm not sure what you're implying by the last sentence? I know that Cody, Peter, and I have gone to lengths like not speaking to each other after getting the questions to keep things above board. Though if you feel like we've been doing something wrong, please message me, because I'd really love to hear it and make sure everything looks above board, too.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:50 pm
by ValenciaQBowl
Thanks for this generous and reasoned reply, Bradley. And now, at risk of earning the banhammer of loving discipline, I'm going to tell everyone how to post and say that this conversation is moot; Peter is TD and is not playing, Damion is there to help, and we're all going to have a swell time. So let's stop this discussion and use this thread for specific updates to the tournament.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:53 pm
by Auks Ran Ova
I will...allow it.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:03 pm
by Jewish Pugilist
Hi all, I updated the original post to reflect that It's Lit will be played on Saturday. If you would like to sign up a pair, the google sheet now has an "It's Lit's" tab (Thanks Jonathen)

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:40 pm
by Jewish Pugilist
Here is the first field update
NASAT FIeld 18/20
Thanks Ugly God
The Melo Hostage Crisis
Something Homeomorphic to USF A
Notes on Cyclic adenosine monophosphate
Beyer et al.
Alt-Right Said Fred (which I think merged with the Seth Kendall solo team. If not, let me know)
Coach Riley et al.
Kelson et al.
Portrait of a Lady Gaga
Winstead + Freddy
CSN A
CSN B
Buchholz
FSU
Valenthia
Chipotle A
Chipotle B
Asteroids

Super ACRONYM 3/6
Beyer et al.
A Day in the Life of Pablo Honey Boo Boo Child
Cyborg AND C-Borg

It's Lit 6/8
CSN
Dos Remedios/Torres/Law
Shaw/Harvey
The Amazing Adventures of Cavaliers and Kyrie
Foster/Stone
Mirkin/Kim

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:04 am
by wd4gdz
I wonder if 18 would be a better number to cap the field since we'll probably need people on byes to read.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:47 am
by Jewish Pugilist
wd4gdz wrote:I wonder if 18 would be a better number to cap the field since we'll probably need people on byes to read.
18 has been the number I have been thinking of and others have been recommending, but the original number Chris and I decided was 20 so I wanted to keep it there until I had a confirmation. I do have 10 staffers not counting UCFers who are planning to help out, so we could potentially do a 20 team tournament, but it would stretch us thin for sure

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:23 am
by wd4gdz
It's awesome to hear you have lined up so much staff.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:10 pm
by Alkres
Just posting to let you know that I will be coming down. I will be a free agent and need to be added to a team if possible, or if it's easier I can staff the main tourney and just play the side events.

User was reminded to enable a signature. --Mgmt.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Wed Aug 16, 2017 5:21 pm
by Jewish Pugilist
Hi all
I am going to close the tournament fields for all three events. For those going to SACRONYM, try to be there by 4 o'clock with rounds starting half an hour later.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:57 pm
by Alkres
Fees for free agents?

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 8:06 am
by quiz4life
This was a great tournament! It was a lot of fun and it was so well run. The schedule was right-on-time and the staff was excellent. As a coach of the only true high school team (meaning we only played high school students) I also appreciated how kind the other players and staff were to my young players. My players and I throughly enjoyed themselves.

Well done Peter and the great staff!

Thank you,

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 8:11 pm
by ValenciaQBowl
Here are the stats: http://www.hsquizbowl.org/db/tournament ... standings/

A team of me, Aaron Dos Remedios, (Valencia player) Joseph Pajuelo, and a resurgent Seth Kendall went undefeated to win the shebang.

I'll echo Michael's positive comments about the tournament itself. The readers were good, and things moved efficiently and smoothly. And the NASAT set was excellent-- it provided challenging and interesting lead-ins but answer lines that allowed the CC and high school teams to convert most questions.

Re: NASAT Weekend at Valencia College (August 19th)

Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 10:55 pm
by adosreme
I'd like to add my voice to the praise above.

Thanks Chris and the rest of my teammates for letting me play with them.
Thanks to all the readers and scorekeepers who gave up their time to staff this tournament.
Thanks to Peter for the wonderful job he did keeping everything running smoothly all day.
Thanks to the writers for producing an awesome tournament.
Thanks to everyone else for your most excellent hospitality.

I hope to see you all again sometime soon!