CBI Regionals Discussion

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CBI Regionals Discussion

Post by geekjohnson » Thu Feb 14, 2008 7:33 pm

Because we all love CBI so much. Who all is making the trip to play on those wonderful questions? In case you do not get it, I do not like CBI, and am not quite Jason M. Well, regardless, it's a free trip to Jacksonville, and some bastard form of Alabama will be there the weekend after next.

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Post by Jeremy Gibbs Lemma » Thu Feb 14, 2008 8:07 pm

For the first time in god knows how long, we are not wasting our time with this.

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Post by jhn31 » Thu Feb 14, 2008 9:49 pm

MSU will be there, but without one of our top 2 scorers, who refused to go.
I agree that the tournament isn't very good, but I bad quiz bowl is better than none in my book, and who doesn't love a free trip to Jacksonville with official excused abscences.

Really though, I'm a hardcore MSU baseball fan, and we're opening the season at North Florida, so I'm going to be sure to check out the opening series while I'm in town.

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Post by Your Genial Quizmaster » Thu Feb 14, 2008 11:25 pm

UTC is attending Region 5, for the first time in 7 or 8 years -- after years without funding, we got support directly from the Chancellor's office to go to CBI. (And before you ask: no, I'm not going.)

The same funding also led to full-fledged CBI Intramurals for the first time in my coaching tenure. It was successful in the way that matters most: We had ten new players that night, several of whom did well and have expressed interest in joining our program.

CBI still isn't my cup of tea; my format of preference remains mACF, with no clock, no variable value bonuses, and especially pyramidal tossups. But Intramurals reminded me that there's still something to be said for entry-level quizbowl.

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Post by Matt Weiner » Thu Feb 14, 2008 11:36 pm

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Post by PaladinQB » Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:05 am

Your Genial Quizmaster wrote:It was successful in the way that matters most: We had ten new players that night, several of whom did well and have expressed interest in joining our program.

But Intramurals reminded me that there's still something to be said for entry-level quizbowl.
NAQT wrote: The full 2007-2008 NAQT Intramural set (15 packets). These are introductory questions that can be used for an on-campus tournament involving teams from dorm floors, clubs, fraternities, the honors program, and so forth. This is a way for the team to publicize its existence to the institution as a whole as well as to scout the student body for potential varsity team players.

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Post by Aaron Kashtan » Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:07 am

I'm not attending CBI Regionals. Once was more than enough.

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Post by NoahMinkCHS » Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:12 am

Aaron Kashtan wrote:I'm not attending CBI Regionals. Once was more than enough.
Although you must admit, you were a helluva CBI player. No Jason Mueller, but still...

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Post by Council of Trent Reznor » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:56 am

Illinois has been (mercifully) released from CBI, so we'll be giving it a miss for the rest of Earth's lifespan. But I am going to entertain offers for a "Top Scorer" plaque from last year from any interested parties on these boards before I finally put the damn thing on eBay like I've been swearing I would for a year now.
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Post by Auks Ran Ova » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:26 am

I will bid the princely sum of $0.00.
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Post by wd4gdz » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:49 am

I'm going to CBI just to spite UGA

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Post by AKKOLADE » Fri Feb 15, 2008 8:29 am

strifeheart wrote:I will bid the princely sum of $0.00.
I bid the half or third packet or however many sports questions I've written for your tournaments in the past month or two.
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Post by Bigfoot isn't the pr » Fri Feb 15, 2008 9:52 am

U of D is going this year for the first time in many a year. CBI actually contacted UD asking if they could hold a tourney and send a team to regionals. Always wanting (good) publicity our students activities organization set the tourney fourth. We got a free judge out of it and the two winning teams (one of which was UD) all got Tungsten PDAs and the top two scorers got iPods.

So we're attending regionals. I'll be there. I like an AB road-trip though after last year's divine-intervention-keeping-us-from-winning-a-round incident at :chip: 's tournament I am not expecting much from a non-ACF/NAQT tourney.
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Post by btressler » Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:44 am

Yes, those of us on Delaware's team conspired to deaffiliate after the departure of Dave Balseiro.

So this year, CBI undoes our efforts by direct contacting an administrator.

Is this a neat trick others are experiencing?

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Post by NoahMinkCHS » Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:46 am

wd4gdz wrote:I'm going to CBI just to spite UGA
Haha, not sure I understand how that works, but since you brought it up...

Since we beat y'all at ACF Fall, and you beat us at SCT... doesn't that make CBI the effective regular-season tiebreaker? I mean, kind of?

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Post by grapesmoker » Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:56 am

Stat74 wrote:Yes, those of us on Delaware's team conspired to deaffiliate after the departure of Dave Balseiro.

So this year, CBI undoes our efforts by direct contacting an administrator.

Is this a neat trick others are experiencing?
What was the result of them contacting the administrator?
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Post by Matt Weiner » Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:58 am

Stat74 wrote:Yes, those of us on Delaware's team conspired to deaffiliate after the departure of Dave Balseiro.

So this year, CBI undoes our efforts by direct contacting an administrator.

Is this a neat trick others are experiencing?
Isn't this how it's always been? College Bowl has a network of random student union employees who don't know anything. They are the market, not quizbowl teams.

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Post by jhn31 » Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:46 pm

Matt Weiner wrote:
Stat74 wrote:Yes, those of us on Delaware's team conspired to deaffiliate after the departure of Dave Balseiro.

So this year, CBI undoes our efforts by direct contacting an administrator.

Is this a neat trick others are experiencing?
Isn't this how it's always been? College Bowl has a network of random student union employees who don't know anything. They are the market, not quizbowl teams.
YES! I nearly killed some of the CAB (Campus Activities Board) members who ran our campus College Bowl tournament for not having a clue how quiz bowl works!
We tried to at least let them allow the quiz bowl team to run the campus tournament, but they wouldn't hear to it. Also, the CAB owns three buzzers sets solely for hosting the annual campus CB tournament and won't let us borrow them...

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Post by ValenciaQBowl » Fri Feb 15, 2008 1:25 pm

Some of my former Valencians have nearly abandoned their efforts to (re)start a program at UCF because of the insistence by activities people that they can't even call themselves the QB team until they've "qualified" through a CBI intramural. I wonder if one way to fight this kind of attitude would be to get a faculty advisor (tenured) who understands the game (or at least is friendly to you and willing to throw his weight around) for your team. Tenured faculty can often make things happen that students might not.

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Post by Mike Bentley » Fri Feb 15, 2008 1:27 pm

ValenciaQBowl wrote:Some of my former Valencians have nearly abandoned their efforts to (re)start a program at UCF because of the insistence by activities people that they can't even call themselves the QB team until they've "qualified" through a CBI intramural. I wonder if one way to fight this kind of attitude would be to get a faculty advisor (tenured) who understands the game (or at least is friendly to you and willing to throw his weight around) for your team. Tenured faculty can often make things happen that students might not.
Could they just call themselves something else? The UCF ACF Squad, for instance?
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Post by grapesmoker » Fri Feb 15, 2008 1:49 pm

ValenciaQBowl wrote:Some of my former Valencians have nearly abandoned their efforts to (re)start a program at UCF because of the insistence by activities people that they can't even call themselves the QB team until they've "qualified" through a CBI intramural. I wonder if one way to fight this kind of attitude would be to get a faculty advisor (tenured) who understands the game (or at least is friendly to you and willing to throw his weight around) for your team. Tenured faculty can often make things happen that students might not.
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Post by PaladinQB » Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:03 pm

grapesmoker wrote: When the revolution comes, student government will be first up against the wall.
Student government is composed of students; they're supposed to be stupid. The professionals of student affairs are the real miscreants in this and many other issues facing the academy.

Edited to remove extraneous carriage return.
Last edited by PaladinQB on Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by ValenciaQBowl » Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:08 pm

Could they just call themselves something else? The UCF ACF Squad, for instance?
Sure. They can call themselves whatever they want. But if they want money, they gots to display their props by surviving the CBI gauntlet!

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Post by Skepticism and Animal Feed » Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:35 pm

So who's left on the mainstream circuit that still plays CBI? Minnesota? UCLA?
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Post by Auks Ran Ova » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:12 pm

This may be our last year of playing CBI. I personally am starting the party early by abstaining this year.
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Post by DumbJaques » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:10 pm

This may be our last year of playing CBI. I personally am starting the party early by abstaining this year.
Is it time for ACF to start a Courage Award for people who struggle against CBI?
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Post by cvdwightw » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:48 pm

Bruce wrote:So who's left on the mainstream circuit that still plays CBI? Minnesota? UCLA?
UCLA has not run a student union-sponsored intermural since 2005. We were able to get student union money to play CBI in 2006 and got the questions for free in 2007 along with a small amount of transportation and RCT fees paid for by the student union (we ran a sham intermural tournament both years since the student union couldn't staff one themselves). Based on what I've seen from the UCLA club mailing list, there has been no discussion of an intermural tournament, and since RCT is only a week away, I'm under the assumption that they've de-affiliated for monetary reasons.

USC is likely the only true circuit team left in our region that plays CBI.

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Post by Important Bird Area » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:58 pm

Matt Weiner wrote:
Stat74 wrote:So this year, CBI undoes our efforts by direct contacting an administrator.

Is this a neat trick others are experiencing?
Isn't this how it's always been? College Bowl has a network of random student union employees who don't know anything. They are the market, not quizbowl teams.
Princeton's club carries the name "Princeton College Bowl" as a legacy from the early 80s when CBI was the only game around. In 2001 (this would be four years after we deaffiliated) I was contacted by a student union staffer who couldn't figure out why CBI had been badgering the student union to start a brand-new team while "Princeton College Bowl" had regular Thursday meetings. I explained that 1. our budget came from running our high school tournament, not from the student union 2. we could send three teams to ICT for less than the cost of CBI registration and 3. we had to play NAQT and ACF if we wanted to play against Harvard and Yale. They didn't bother contacting me again.
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Post by btressler » Fri Feb 15, 2008 6:27 pm

jhn31 wrote:YES! I nearly killed some of the CAB (Campus Activities Board) members who ran our campus College Bowl tournament for not having a clue how quiz bowl works!
We tried to at least let them allow the quiz bowl team to run the campus tournament, but they wouldn't hear to it. Also, the CAB owns three buzzers sets solely for hosting the annual campus CB tournament and won't let us borrow them...
That is exactly what happened at UD. Since they had enough bureaucrats who didn't know what they were doing, I was able to get out of any moderating duties (I am thankfully ineligible to play because my taking of classes is over for at least a little while.)

The buzzer owned by the university is allowed to be signed out by any group, and the Academic Competition Club is the only group that can sign it out for a weekend. So at least the club got an extra judge available to them.

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Post by Awehrman » Fri Feb 15, 2008 7:11 pm

Isn't this how it's always been? College Bowl has a network of random student union employees who don't know anything. They are the market, not quizbowl teams.
The professionals of student affairs are the real miscreants in this and many other issues facing the academy.
I think that one of the main challenges that quizbowl has in no way overcome is how to deal effectively with universities. People in student activities don't particularly care about quizbowl, it's true, but they also don't care about CBI. CBI effectively communicates with them and offers a polished-sounding product. These student affairs people know that CBI is expensive, but they do not, for the most part, know about alternatives. I think that too often quizbowl players only attempt to contact student affairs people when something goes wrong or to bemoan the current state of things without patiently explaining the benefits of one company over another. But, students should not have to make the case entirely on their own as NAQT and ACF force them to do.

My wife is the Student Activities Coordinator at IIT (Illinois Institute of Technology). A group of students there wanted to compete in College Bowl Regionals as they had done in the past. When they approached my wife, they were astounded that she actually knew anything about quizbowl, and were also surprised that organized quizbowl existed beyond CBI. She helped them register for NAQT Sectionals last week (they finished a respectable 5-9 at their first ever NAQT tournament), and they are going to play in UIUC's tournament in March. She decided that CBI is too expensive and too far away, so the Union Board will fund these other tournaments instead.

This very weekend my wife is attending the national conference for NACA (National Association for Campus Activities) in St. Louis. Part of the conference is a showcase for organizations to advertise their wares to student affairs professionals. During the conference, attendees will make decisions about what sorts of events to sponsor and where money should be spent for the following year. NAQT should be there. CBI has an affiliation with ACUI (Association of College Unions International), but if NAQT became affiliated with NACA, schools would receive an alternative (plus many colleges and universities are not affiliated with ACUI but are NACA members). NAQT should emphasize its much lower prices and its popularity among quizbowlers. It's really not that big of a stretch for this to happen. Campus activities people are very responsive to new organizations especially ones that will both make students happy and save money, but they simply never hear from anyone but CBI.

I should also mention that for the first time in several years Northwestern will not be playing in CBI Regionals.

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Post by Council of Trent Reznor » Fri Feb 15, 2008 7:33 pm

Northwestern and U of I out? Who does that leave in that regional? The Valparaiso Virgins?

On a somewhat more serious note, I would like to express my approval of everything Awherman mentioned above. Although these boards probably can't arm-twist NAQT into trying the above recommendations, perhaps some of the ACF muckamucks could prepare some kind of guide to people trying to pry their university away from the money pit of CBI - maybe a list of tangent points to make, or a statement that can be expanded and retooled by the students using it to meet their specific needs.
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Post by grapesmoker » Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:21 pm

The difficulty for ACF to do anything is that we're not actually any kind of official organization. We're just a bunch of guys, and I'm not sure whether anyone from outside the circuit is going to take anything we say seriously. Of course, I wouldn't be opposed to trying it, but I think a lot more thought needs to be put into it before we do anything.
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Post by mhayes » Sat Feb 16, 2008 12:25 am

When I look at some of the teams who sign up for CBI regionals, I can't help but think of what it would be like if half of them participated in NAQT or ACF events every year. For the most part, we don't see these teams at events like ACF Fall or any quiz bowl event independent of CBI.

As it is, I'm sure most of them don't know quiz bowl exists outside of CBI, and I think that's rather unfortunate.

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Post by Mr. Kwalter » Sat Feb 16, 2008 2:58 pm

For what it's worth, Matt Weiner has been making a concerted effort to reach out to CBI and Honda teams all over the country. He is currently compiling a list of CBI/Honda contacts and has asked a few of us for help. I'm sure if anyone here were willing to help him out with that, he'd be delighted to accept. I also agree with Andy; Texas hasn't received a dime from the union since I matriculated, but we have received funding through one of the university's VPs. Honestly, Matt Nance and I put on suits, went down there, and talked to him about qb, and the next week we had funding for ICT and ACF nationals. Don't be afraid to approach non-union officials for cash; it's worth a try, and no bad can come of it.
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Post by First Chairman » Sat Feb 16, 2008 3:37 pm

Awehrman wrote:This very weekend my wife is attending the national conference for NACA (National Association for Campus Activities) in St. Louis. Part of the conference is a showcase for organizations to advertise their wares to student affairs professionals. During the conference, attendees will make decisions about what sorts of events to sponsor and where money should be spent for the following year. NAQT should be there. CBI has an affiliation with ACUI (Association of College Unions International), but if NAQT became affiliated with NACA, schools would receive an alternative (plus many colleges and universities are not affiliated with ACUI but are NACA members). NAQT should emphasize its much lower prices and its popularity among quizbowlers. It's really not that big of a stretch for this to happen. Campus activities people are very responsive to new organizations especially ones that will both make students happy and save money, but they simply never hear from anyone but CBI.

I should also mention that for the first time in several years Northwestern will not be playing in CBI Regionals.
Hey Andy,

Obviously I would wonder how anyone becomes affiliated with NACA, and how much would that cost?
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Post by Awehrman » Sat Feb 16, 2008 6:50 pm

For what it's worth, Matt Weiner has been making a concerted effort to reach out to CBI and Honda teams all over the country. He is currently compiling a list of CBI/Honda contacts and has asked a few of us for help. I'm sure if anyone here were willing to help him out with that, he'd be delighted to accept.
I know that Matt and many other individuals have reached out to CBI teams and have had some success, but I think that it's difficult for these teams who are usually formed by student union personnel to connect with someone who appeals to them outside of their usual channels (i.e. regional and national conferences and the like). There are also plenty of schools who do not participate in CBI who are isolated from the efforts of the quizbowl community at present.
Hey Andy,

Obviously I would wonder how anyone becomes affiliated with NACA, and how much would that cost?
http://www.naca.org

The NACA website has information on becoming an associate member and how much booth space and showcases cost. It's not particularly cheap (national membership is 654 dollars), but considering that the convention is, in their words, "the largest campus activities marketplace in the country," I think it's worth a shot. Over a thousand schools are members of NACA, and of those over 700 attended regional conferences in 2006. I think it also may help that NACA is headquartered in Columbia, South Carolina, a stronghold of high school quizbowl. If NAQT (or PACE or ACF, but I really think NAQT has the best chance for success here) were to explore this, it might be better to contact the Board of Directors directly.

Fundamentally I think that quizbowl needs to decide what it is all about. Is it a campus activity that should be grouped with other large student groups and funded by student fees, or is it a quasi-maverick activity played by people in-the-know disconnected from a traditional student programming set-up? I think that a lot of quizbowl players have disdain for other student groups and campus activities personnel (as evidenced by comments earlier in this thread) and like organizing their travel, finances, and tournaments independently. This has a certain appeal and has worked relatively well over the years thanks to tremendous efforts of certain individuals in the quizbowl community, but I feel that it limits the growth potential for quizbowl as an activity on all university campuses.

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Post by Important Bird Area » Sun Feb 17, 2008 12:36 pm

Awehrman wrote:a lot of quizbowl players have disdain for other student groups and campus activities personnel... and like organizing their travel, finances, and tournaments independently. This has a certain appeal and has worked relatively well over the years thanks to tremendous efforts of certain individuals in the quizbowl community, but I feel that it limits the growth potential for quizbowl as an activity on all university campuses.
I think this argument is conjoining unrelated issues. It's fine to expand participation in quizbowl by connecting with new revenue sources and accepting outside input on subsequent travel plans ("student fees should be used for attending the academic nationals, not for sending five teams cross-country to a guerrilla trash tournament"). On the other hand, this thread barely scratches the surface of why having campus activities personnel organize quizbowl tournaments is a bad idea. (Fundamentally, because someone who can't be bothered to, say, discover that NAQT exists will at best reinvent the wheel and at worst destroy a tournament.)
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Post by cvdwightw » Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:18 pm

I would hazard a guess that none of you have played a NAQT/QU hybrid tournament run by non-quizbowl people. Even if people do know NAQT exists, you still get players who know more about how the game works than the staff, among other problems.

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Post by Awehrman » Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:46 pm

I think this argument is conjoining unrelated issues. It's fine to expand participation in quizbowl by connecting with new revenue sources and accepting outside input on subsequent travel plans ("student fees should be used for attending the academic nationals, not for sending five teams cross-country to a guerrilla trash tournament"). On the other hand, this thread barely scratches the surface of why having campus activities personnel organize quizbowl tournaments is a bad idea. (Fundamentally, because someone who can't be bothered to, say, discover that NAQT exists will at best reinvent the wheel and at worst destroy a tournament.)
I think you're missing part of my point here. I'm not really suggesting that campus activities run quizbowl tournaments, but rather that we need to help make these people aware that quizbowl exists beyond CBI and create structures for teams to attend tournaments using student fees rather than (or in addition to) tournament revenues. There would certainly be some bumps in the road in forming legitimate quizbowl programs at schools that have never had them before. Why should we stop people from attempting to participate in what I view as a valuable activity for both students and institutions because some local tournaments might be run poorly at first? If we want to expand, we're going to have to accept that some people are going to be new at this. This is why I feel that NAQT should be the vanguard. CBI runs lousy tournaments on lousy questions. Wouldn't lousy tournaments on better questions be an improvement? Also, from my experience, when campus activities people do run tournaments, their problems often come from following CBI's tournament guides too closely and shutting out the suggestions of people in-the-know. I think NAQT could do a much better job of instructing these coordinators to work with quizbowl clubs and could create tournament guides more fitting with the standards of the quizbowl community.

Another improvement (again from talking to my wife) would be if NAQT (or ACF or whomever) created a website for entering and paying for tournaments. It is difficult for her as a student affairs person to write a check to a different person or club for each tournament (each name has to be individually approved and entered into the school's payment system). I have also had problems dealing with campus activities people when trying to receive funds for the next year, when I do not know the specifics on how much a tournament will cost in advance or who the money will go to (especially if hosts have not been announced). If NAQT were to set up a website where schools could pay by credit card, it would eliminate this problem. Each sectional could have drop-down menus for things like buzzer discounts, etc. NAQT could then after collecting the money, send whatever money earned by the host school to them after the tournament. From NAQT's standpoint this would insure that they get paid (I know I've been guilty of long delays in paying NAQT for questions after hosting a tournament), and it would cut some of the red-tape that fledgling programs have to go through.

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Post by NoahMinkCHS » Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:35 pm

Awehrman wrote:Another improvement (again from talking to my wife) would be if NAQT (or ACF or whomever) created a website for entering and paying for tournaments. It is difficult for her as a student affairs person to write a check to a different person or club for each tournament (each name has to be individually approved and entered into the school's payment system). I have also had problems dealing with campus activities people when trying to receive funds for the next year, when I do not know the specifics on how much a tournament will cost in advance or who the money will go to (especially if hosts have not been announced). If NAQT were to set up a website where schools could pay by credit card, it would eliminate this problem. Each sectional could have drop-down menus for things like buzzer discounts, etc. NAQT could then after collecting the money, send whatever money earned by the host school to them after the tournament. From NAQT's standpoint this would insure that they get paid (I know I've been guilty of long delays in paying NAQT for questions after hosting a tournament), and it would cut some of the red-tape that fledgling programs have to go through.
That would be pretty cool, and certainly makes sense from an NAQT standpoint.

If they weren't interested, someone else could set up an independent system that could handle processing for NAQT, ACF, circuit, even high school events. I think the business model would be that a tournament host would sign up their tournament with this service -- let's call it Quizbowl Payment LLC for illustration -- and then say to competing teams, direct all payments there. QP LLC would, if it were any good, take checks, credit card payments, maybe even money orders, and then shave a percentage off the top to cover credit card costs, general overhead, and profit. This would probably mean hosts would have to increase their fees, or charge a higher fee to QP customers if the host also wanted to offer a cash option.

This seems like it would have a lot of benefits -- clubs getting institutional funds would only need to use one payment address for many tournaments; there would be an end to "Dammit, I said make the check out to ME, not the team!" syndrome; and (possibly a bad thing), if teams find themselves temporarily short on cash, they could charge the whole thing to a credit card and pay it off when the money does come in.

I'm not sure how much money there is to be made here; I assume one would have to do this as a service to the community first, and hope that one day one might be compensated for the time spent. But as a host and attendee of many tournaments, I'd love to see it implemented.

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Post by evilmonkey » Sun Feb 17, 2008 4:07 pm

Notre Dame has a strange and awkward relationship with CBI. CBI was here long before real quiz bowl, and like other places you have to qualify through that stupid tournament. We failed to do so this year, partially because our two best players were split between two teams. Thus, I have no idea what the ND CBI rep is doing.

However, we have a problem regarding CBI that I believe is unique.
From our club's constitution
In accordance with the Student Activities Office the ACCND will also abide by the following regarding its relationship with the College Bowl tournament:

The College Bowl tournament adminstered by the Student Activities Office is an established program on campus and the ACCND will not program against it. If the ACCND decides to run trivia question and answer type tournaments on campus, these tournaments will take place only during the spring semester because the College Bowl campus tournament takes place during the fall semester.
Does anyone else have this problem?
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Post by Mr. Kwalter » Sun Feb 17, 2008 4:58 pm

NoahMinkCHS wrote:If they weren't interested, someone else could set up an independent system that could handle processing for NAQT, ACF, circuit, even high school events. I think the business model would be that a tournament host would sign up their tournament with this service -- let's call it Quizbowl Payment LLC for illustration -- and then say to competing teams, direct all payments there. QP LLC would, if it were any good, take checks, credit card payments, maybe even money orders, and then shave a percentage off the top to cover credit card costs, general overhead, and profit. This would probably mean hosts would have to increase their fees, or charge a higher fee to QP customers if the host also wanted to offer a cash option.

This seems like it would have a lot of benefits -- clubs getting institutional funds would only need to use one payment address for many tournaments; there would be an end to "Dammit, I said make the check out to ME, not the team!" syndrome; and (possibly a bad thing), if teams find themselves temporarily short on cash, they could charge the whole thing to a credit card and pay it off when the money does come in.
As someone who has coordinated three ACF Falls now, I can say that this would be a HUGE convenience. We have had problems with teams not being allowed to pay ACF because we're essentially, as Jerry put it, just a group of guys. Without consulting with the other members I can't say ACF would officially support this plan, but I know from my experience as a tournament coordinator that doing this would make things astronomically more convenient.

Along with convenience this would essentially eliminate the endless badgering sometimes required for ACF and mACF tournaments with several mirrors to get their money from hosts. If we had a central official group whom teams could pay for the tournament, the tables would be turned, and it would be, say, ACF's responsibility to pay the hosts what they're owed after they receive a check from the central group. I personally consider groups like ACF more likely to promptly make good on payment than many individual hosts.
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Post by Awehrman » Sun Feb 17, 2008 5:52 pm

3D Lemmings, can you change your club's constitution? This seems like a situation where you and your club should meet with your activities people and try to get them to understand the situation. I'm not sure that your situation is unique, though. I'm willing to bet that CBI has used this method to stifle competition on other campuses as well. This is another case where the presence of an alternative quizbowl organization would help campus activities personnel do away with CBI.

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Post by Important Bird Area » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:05 pm

Awehrman wrote:I think you're missing part of my point here... Why should we stop people from attempting to participate in what I view as a valuable activity for both students and institutions because some local tournaments might be run poorly at first?
I didn't mean to imply that I was somehow against expanding the circuit to new teams. I just wanted to indicate that ceding student activities people control over tournament planning is a bad idea because it leads to indefensible regulations like the Notre Dame example quoted above.
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Post by UDEL-ACC » Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:01 pm

UD has been very supportive of this, even if it's something we had stopped doing years ago.

They are paying for everything (and will most likely continue to do so if we make nationals). So sure, the questions and competition arent naqt/acf worthy, but it should be entertaining.

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Post by rylltraka » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:22 pm

Dwight's correct, in at least that USC may be the only circuit team in CA still playing CBI (Stanford, maybe? They tend not to, but they have before). I don't foresee the club excising CBI from our schedule in the neat future.

I, for one, am unapologetic about going. It's free for us (we have a good rep in student affairs and run an intramural through them), it's fun, and I prefer timed tournaments. I've long since reconciled with CBI's faults.

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Post by philmsu » Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:19 am

I'm the captain of Missouri State's CBI regional team. At the moment, I'm not aware of any attempts, current or past, to send teams to any of the other formats. I think that's the lack of knowledge factor over anything else--I didn't even know ACF or NAQT existed until I happened upon you guys about a year ago. (Yeah, I've been lurking that long.) I'd love it if we were involved in more formats, because if nothing else, that's more chances to compete in quizbowl than a piddly one per year. And from what I've gathered (low attendance at campus tourneys and the high number of people who say when I tell them what I'm doing, "No way, we do trivia competitions?") a lot of people don't even know we do any quizbowl.

I'm putting together a presentation I can pitch about making a full-fledged quizbowl club and getting involved. At some point, talk will have to become action, but the resources here and at NAQT's site have helped immensely in letting me know what to expect. My teammate and I were practicing for regionals earlier today in the Union and drew interest from people sitting nearby (and one girl even started playing along with us) so I guess that's a good sign that there are people interested who just need to know that they have options.

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Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) » Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:48 am

Kenshiro, would you mind contacting me? I live in Missouri and am probably going to go to Mizzou next year and would love to help out your team somehow. My aim is ohreally01 and my email is charlie16@gmail.com. Also, there is moquizbowl.com , another forum specifically for Missouri quizbowl if you are interested. Best of luck and I hope to see you get out some next year.
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Post by Mike Bentley » Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:52 am

Deesy Does It wrote:Kenshiro, would you mind contacting me? I live in Missouri and am probably going to go to Mizzou next year and would love to help out your team somehow. My aim is ohreally01 and my email is charlie16@gmail.com. Also, there is moquizbowl.com , another forum specifically for Missouri quizbowl if you are interested. Best of luck and I hope to see you get out some next year.
Does this mean you're graduating, Charlie?
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Post by evilmonkey » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:05 am

Bentley Like Beckham wrote: Does this mean you're graduating, Charlie?
So thats what they call it now...
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