2019 HSNCT discussion

NAQT HSNCT, NAQT IPNCT, NAQT SSNCT, PACE NSC, and NASAT are discussed here.
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2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Wed May 29, 2019 4:01 pm

This is your question-specific discussion thread for the 2019 NAQT HSNCT.

The usual disclaimers apply:

1) If you are planning to play a mirror of the 2019 HSNCT set, please do not read further posts in this thread. (There is one mirror currently planned, at Toronto; it's possible we may add other mirrors to our schedule.)

2) I will be traveling for most of the next week, so please be patient if I do not respond immediately to requests for question text.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Curious Homunculus » Wed May 29, 2019 4:30 pm

Could you post the tossup on transformers from Round 22? I know anecdotally that a lot of very good science players negged the tossup with inductors on the clues describing the physical characteristics of transformers.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by dni » Wed May 29, 2019 4:40 pm

Could I see the tossup on regression? I negged it with "machine learning" after the first clause of the first clue, which I believe mentioned L2 regularization.
Could I also see the tossup on polonium? I'm just curious as to what clues came after the first one haha.
Last edited by dni on Wed May 29, 2019 4:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by J. Young » Wed May 29, 2019 4:41 pm

Can I see conversion stats for the bonus on fictional metals (alloys?)? Curious as to how many teams converted the third part.
Last edited by J. Young on Wed May 29, 2019 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by CPiGuy » Wed May 29, 2019 4:41 pm

As a moderator, I noticed that this set had a much higher frequency of copyediting issues that interfered with my ability to read -- there was an omitted preposition/article, an instance of "the that" or something like that, or something along those lines almost every round, and sometimes several times in a packet. In several cases it seemed like the question had been edited to change a word but that they hadn't done it the whole way, if that makes sense. I also noticed this problem at MSNCT. The only one I specifically remember was a tossup on Chile that began with "This sea off this country" or something along those lines, which required me to stop the clock and read the question to figure out what the pronoun actually was.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Wed May 29, 2019 4:48 pm

2019 HSNCT round 22 wrote:The open-circuit test can determine the impedance in one of these devices, which are typically rated in volt-amperes. To minimize leakage flux in these devices, their windings are commonly arranged concentrically around a high-permeability core. These devices use (*) induction to transfer electrical energy between circuits. For 10 points—name these devices that are used to "step up" or "step down" voltage.
2019 HSNCT round 24 wrote:When an L2 penalty is used in this process, the result is called Tikhonov regularization, or the "ridge" version of this process. In one form of this process, the matrix "X transpose X inverse X transpose" is called the "hat matrix." By the Gauss- (*) Markov theorem, the best unbiased estimator for this process's linear case is the ordinary least squares method. For 10 points—what technique estimates two variables' relationship?

answer: regression (or linear regression or ridge regression or ordinary least squares regression or OLS regression)
2019 HSNCT round 19 wrote:This is the only element to form a simple cubic crystal structure. The Soviet Lunokhod rovers used it as a heat source on the Moon. This element combined with beryllium forms a neutron initiator for nuclear weapons, since this element rapidly alpha decays directly into (*) lead. In 2006 ex-KGB agent Alexander Litvinenko was fatally poisoned by—for 10 points—what element named after the home country of Marie Curie?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Wed May 29, 2019 4:49 pm

CPiGuy wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 4:41 pm
As a moderator, I noticed that this set had a much higher frequency of copyediting issues that interfered with my ability to read -- there was an omitted preposition/article, an instance of "the that" or something like that, or something along those lines almost every round, and sometimes several times in a packet. In several cases it seemed like the question had been edited to change a word but that they hadn't done it the whole way, if that makes sense. I also noticed this problem at MSNCT. The only one I specifically remember was a tossup on Chile that began with "This sea off this country" or something along those lines, which required me to stop the clock and read the question to figure out what the pronoun actually was.
Our apologies for the copyediting issues present in this year's national championships; please feel free to send us details (errata@naqt.com or feel free to contact me directly).
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by worr72 » Wed May 29, 2019 4:51 pm

Can I see the tossups on Blindness, Satie, and Mexico (literature)?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by setht » Wed May 29, 2019 4:53 pm

J. Young wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 4:41 pm
Can I see conversion stats for the bonus on fictional metals (alloys?)? Curious as to how many teams converted the third part.
I'm not sure when we expect to have conversion data available, but I would guess it will be at least a month.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Wed May 29, 2019 4:54 pm

2019 HSNCT round 19 wrote:In this novel, an old woman who lives on rabbits and chickens is found dead holding a set of keys. A man with a black eye patch in this novel hides under bed covers to listen to a radio. A car thief in this novel dies after being kicked with a stiletto heel by a girl with (*) dark glasses. The doctor's wife is the only one not afflicted by the title "white sickness" in—for 10 points—what novel by Jose Saramago?
2019 HSNCT round 23 wrote:A piano piece in 3/4 time by this composer features a quarter-note melody over pianissimo G-major seventh and D-major seventh chords. The term "furniture music" was coined by this composer, who partnered with Jean Cocteau and Pablo Picasso on the ballet (*) Parade. This composer wrote seven movements for his Three Pieces in the Shape of a Pear. For 10 points—name this French composer of three works called Gymnopedies.
2019 HSNCT round 5 wrote:A 1955 novel is set primarily in this country's town of Comala, which is inhabited by ghosts. In another novel set in this country, a dish of quail in rose petal sauce leaves Gertrudis burning with passion. (*) Pedro P\'aramo and Like Water for Chocolate are both set in this country. Mariano Azuela's The Underdogs is set in—for 10 points—what country, where rebels fought against Victoriano Huerta alongside Pancho Villa?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Here Comes Rusev Day » Wed May 29, 2019 4:59 pm

I thought that this set was largely good with some hard parts of bonuses (especially in history and geography) frequently flying off the rails (Berwick-upon-Tweed with the only clue about it being at war for Russia If I recall correctly, also I can find literally no evidence that this ever happened, unless the bonus mentioned it as a legend of course. I would have to see it again). Conor mentioned it but there were numerous grammatical and copyediting issues in this set that, somewhat at a minimum, affected both me and my partner moderating matches. Obviously these are the only two critiques because it’s clear a good set was put together from this. Congratulations to Beavercreek and all the teams that made the tournament!
Last edited by Here Comes Rusev Day on Wed May 29, 2019 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by J. Young » Wed May 29, 2019 5:02 pm

Here Comes Rusev Day wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 4:59 pm
(Berwick-upon-Tweed with the only clue about it being at war for Russia If I recall correctly, also I can find literally no evidence that this ever happened, unless the bonus mentioned it as a legend of course. I would have to see it again).
The Berwick clue was apparently based on a human interest story about the town 'technically being at war with Russia', see the Daily Beast for example.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by CPiGuy » Wed May 29, 2019 5:04 pm

Oh, actual comment on question content:

The tossup on the "time derivative" should really, really accept "differentiation with respect to time" as an alternate answer and prompt on "differentiation" the same as it does on "derivative".

On another note on that question, I'm a huge fan of NAQT adopting verbose prompts!
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Ozymandias314 » Wed May 29, 2019 5:05 pm

Can I see the tossups on "polymerization" (round 23 I think), "irrational", "Fourier" and "aromatic"? Thanks.

Edit: also the tossup on "time derivative" please

EDIT 2: I was interested with the polymerization tossup because I negged it with "chain reactions", referring to radical chain reactions when I heard the clue about the propagation step. I protested but it ended up not mattering. The three math(ish) things were the only ones I remember my team missing in that category. And I asked for aromatic because I thought I remembered a clue about Friedel Crafts reactions from over the weekend, but I think I'm remembering things wrong now.
Last edited by Ozymandias314 on Wed May 29, 2019 8:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Wed May 29, 2019 5:08 pm

Here Comes Rusev Day wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 4:59 pm
(Berwick-upon-Tweed with the only clue about it being at war for Russia If I recall correctly, also I can find literally no evidence that this ever happened, unless the bonus mentioned it as a legend of course. I would have to see it again).
2019 HSNCT round 3 wrote:One of the earliest burghs was this city on the River Tweed, now in northern England. According to popular legend, it remained at war with Russia for decades after the rest of Britain had settled the Crimean War.
Yes, the "according to popular legend" is in there for good reason.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Rocket21 » Wed May 29, 2019 5:10 pm

Could I see the tossups on "Hull House", "Cameroon", and "Governor of Wisconsin"?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Wed May 29, 2019 5:11 pm

Ozymandias314 wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 5:05 pm
Can I see the tossups on "polymerization" (round 23 I think), "irrational", "Fourier" and "aromatic"? Thanks.

Edit: also the tossup on "time derivative" please
2019 HSNCT round 23 wrote:One mechanism for these reactions is driven by relief of ring strain in cyclic alkenes and is called ROMP. Stereochemical control in these reactions can produce syndiotactic or isotactic products. Free radicals are used in the (*) addition form of these reactions, which have many propagation steps. Nylon and PVC are produced via—for 10 points—what kind of reaction in which monomers are joined to form macromolecules?

answer: polymerization (accept descriptive answers indicating the formation or making of polymers)
2019 HSNCT round 13 wrote:This is the set of values at which the popcorn function is continuous, and also the set of points at which that function is zero. Every infinite continued fraction converges to this type of number. This set contains all (*) transcendental and some algebraic numbers. It can be notated as "R minus Q," meaning the real numbers except Q. For 10 points—what set of numbers have decimal expansions that do not terminate or repeat?
2019 HSNCT round 15 wrote:For a Dirac comb, the "coefficients" named for this mathematician are all equal to 1 over T. A construct named for him tends to overshoot jump discontinuities, a fact called the Gibbs phenomenon. This mathematician stated and solved the (*) heat equation in his 1822 analysis of heat conduction. Periodic functions are written in terms of sine and cosine functions in—for 10 points—what French mathematician's "series"?

answer: (Jean-Baptiste) Joseph Fourier (accept Fourier coefficients or Fourier's law of conduction or Fourier series)
2019 HSNCT round 8 wrote:A compound has this property if there are no unpaired arrows drawn in its Frost circle. An enzyme named for this property converts testosterone to estradiol. Compounds with this property, such as indole and naphthalene, have (*) "4n plus 2" pi electrons which are delocalized around a ring with alternating single and double bonds. Benzene has—for 10 points—what property, which does not actually make a compound odorous?

answer: aromaticity (prompt on "aromatase"; prompt on "(electron) delocalization" or "delocalized (electrons)" or "resonance" before "testosterone")
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Wed May 29, 2019 5:16 pm

2019 HSNCT round 10 wrote:If this operation acting on the vector potential gives zero, then the electric field equals minus the gradient of the scalar potential. The curl of the E-field equals minus this operation applied to the B-field. Minus this operation applied to (*) magnetic flux gives the emf according to Faraday's law. Applying it to charge yields current. For 10 points—what calculus operation is written as "d over dt?"

answer: time derivative (or temporal derivative; accept d - dt or d over dt before "d over dt"; prompt on "derivative" with "with respect to what variable?")
2019 HSNCT round 25 wrote:A magazine named for this institution was co-founded by Willard Motley. This institution's "Plato Club" was led by Julia Lathrop. The Bowen Country Club was a summer camp near Waukegan run by this institution, which opened at 800 South Halsted Street in (*) 1889 after its founders were inspired by a visit to London's Toynbee Hall. Ellen Gates Starr and Jane Addams established--for 10 points--what settlement house in Chicago?
2019 HSNCT round 2 wrote:This country's current president defeated Maurice Kamato in 2018 elections widely seen as fraudulent. Ahmadou Ahidjo was the first independent president of this former German colony that was divided into French and British mandates after World War I. In 1986 over 1,700 people died in a limnic eruption from this country's Lake (*) Nyos. Paul Biya is president of—for 10 points—what African country whose capital is Yaounde?
2019 HSNCT round 22 wrote:The current holder of this office criticized his predecessor's $4.5-billion deal with Foxconn. A 2019 legal fight concerns 82 appointments made by an ex-holder of this office, confirmed by a lame-duck congressional session. In 2012 the holder of this office survived a (*) recall effort over limitations of public employees' collective bargaining rights. For 10 points—in what office did Tony Evers succeed Scott Walker?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Here Comes Rusev Day » Wed May 29, 2019 5:17 pm

Important Bird Area wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 5:08 pm
Here Comes Rusev Day wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 4:59 pm
(Berwick-upon-Tweed with the only clue about it being at war for Russia If I recall correctly, also I can find literally no evidence that this ever happened, unless the bonus mentioned it as a legend of course. I would have to see it again).
2019 HSNCT round 3 wrote:One of the earliest burghs was this city on the River Tweed, now in northern England. According to popular legend, it remained at war with Russia for decades after the rest of Britain had settled the Crimean War.
Yes, the "according to popular legend" is in there for good reason.
Thank you, my partner moderated that game so it didn’t stick as well.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by A_Failure » Wed May 29, 2019 5:29 pm

First of all, I would like to thank NAQT for writing this set. It was very enjoyable to play and also very challenging.

I would like to know why NAQT doesn't but "description acceptable" labels in front of descriptive questions. When these questions come up it's often confusing to have to figure out if the thing it's looking for has a name. The best example of this phenomenon was the question on the restaurant in Nighthawks, where I could have buzzed a line earlier if I knew it was a descriptive answer.

In addition, could I please see the questions on John Kerry, Quebec secession, and Japan (from baseball clues)?

Finally, I would like to see the conversion data on the Carmen and Puccini bonuses when that becomes available. Both of those felt much easier than a nationals playoff bonus should be.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Wed May 29, 2019 5:36 pm

2019 HSNCT round 6 wrote:This man discussed being "the last man to die for a mistake" while testifying to Congress on behalf of Vietnam Veterans Against the War. After Paul Tsongas stepped down in 1984, this man succeeded him in the Senate; 29 years later, this man resigned from the Senate to replace (*) Hillary Clinton as secretary of state. For 10 points--name this Massachusetts politician who lost the 2004 presidential election to George W. Bush.
2019 HSNCT round 7 wrote:A politician who supported this action accused an opponent of letting his "Elliot side" take over before a failed 1980 referendum on it. Bill 99 and a federal Clarity Act were passed following a failed 1995 referendum on this action. A terrorist group that kidnapped James (*) Cross and Pierre Laporte in the October Crisis supported—for 10 points—what action that would separate a French-speaking province from Canada?

answer: secession of Quebec (accept answers mentioning Quebec and the notion of secession (from Canada) or seceding (from Canada) or (gaining) independence or (gaining) sovereignty (from Canada); prompt on less specific answers like "seceding from Canada")
2019 HSNCT round 19 wrote:Sports fans in this country believe the destruction of a Colonel Sanders statue in a 1985 post-game riot began an 18-year "curse." The Pa League and Ce League are both major sports leagues in this country overseen by the NPB. The finals of the first two World (*) Baseball Classics were won by this country, where baseball is called yakyu. For 10 points—what Asian country is home to the Yomiuri Giants and Yokohama BayStars?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by MahoningQuizBowler » Wed May 29, 2019 6:15 pm

Could I see the tossup on Yoda?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Wed May 29, 2019 6:44 pm

2019 HSNCT round 20 wrote:This character survived an assassination attempt at the hands of Commander Gree on Kashyyyk thanks in part to General Tarfful. In a 2017 film, this character destroys a tree of sacred (*) texts on the island of Ahch-To with a bolt of lightning, as a ghost. This character lifted an X-Wing out of the Dagobah swamps after declaring "Do or do not, there is no try" to Luke Skywalker. For 10 points—name this green Jedi master.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by joshxu » Wed May 29, 2019 7:16 pm

Can I see the Turkmenistan (round 1), Bounty Mutiny (round 7), Lake Texcoco (round 7), and Red Sea (round 22) tossups, and the Brunei bonus (round 20)?

Edit: In light of Mike Bentley's post, the reason why I want to see the four tossups is that I feel I could [should?] have powered them all, and I want to see where power ended. For the Brunei bonus, the second part had "Brunei" as its answer and named the sultan in the question as a clue. Two players on my team know that Hassanal Bolkiah is the current sultan of Brunei, but neither of us recognized the name of the sultan the question gave. I'm interested whether 1) both of us misheard the name or 2) a different name for the same person was given.
Last edited by joshxu on Wed May 29, 2019 7:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Mike Bentley » Wed May 29, 2019 7:28 pm

Friendly reminder that you'll make your posts more interesting to other people by saying why you're requesting specific questions. e.g. "I wanted to review this tossup because I think there was a problem with the first clue" or "this tossup was a really neat idea, I wanted to highlight it."
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by bolshevik » Wed May 29, 2019 7:37 pm

Could I see the tossup from the finals on “Dark Souls”? That’s my favorite game (and also I couldn’t tell what was being asked about in the first clue)
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by thederpyaxolotl » Wed May 29, 2019 8:50 pm

Could I see the tossups on calcite and the one that started with a character being beaten to death for saying 2+2=4? I was negged on the first one in power (specifically at stalactite, if I remember correctly) with Calcium Carbonate and protested, but it ended up being moot. The second one my teammate negged and I just wanted to see the question again.
Last edited by thederpyaxolotl on Wed May 29, 2019 9:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by jaguar19 » Wed May 29, 2019 8:57 pm

Could I see tossups on Joshua Tree (Round 1), assassination of RFK (Round 2), Gorbachev (Round 2), American flags (Round 3), Life of Pi (Round 3), murder of John Lennon (Round 5), Lewinsky scandal (Round 7), Guyana (Round 16), George H.W. Bush (Round 17), and Hubert Humphrey (Round 20)?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by thederpyaxolotl » Wed May 29, 2019 8:57 pm

A_Failure wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 5:29 pm
I would like to know why NAQT doesn't but "description acceptable" labels in front of descriptive questions. When these questions come up it's often confusing to have to figure out if the thing it's looking for has a name. The best example of this phenomenon was the question on the restaurant in Nighthawks, where I could have buzzed a line earlier if I knew it was a descriptive answer.
I'm going to agree with Dean here, heard the clues and was pretty confused as to what the question was asking (for what it's worth, I negged anyway with "bar in Nighthawks :/")
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Cheynem » Wed May 29, 2019 9:29 pm

Bar in Nighthawks should probably have been accepted upon protest, right?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by thederpyaxolotl » Wed May 29, 2019 9:34 pm

Cheynem wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 9:29 pm
Bar in Nighthawks should probably have been accepted upon protest, right?
I don't think I lodged a protest, but they were looking for restaurant of diner. I don't think the protest would have mattered anyway.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Ike » Wed May 29, 2019 9:56 pm

I would recommend using an identifier such as "This unnamed location" if you're going to write a tossup on something that doesn't have a reified name. It feels much less hacky than saying "description acceptable."
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by A_Failure » Wed May 29, 2019 9:57 pm

thederpyaxolotl wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 9:34 pm
Cheynem wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 9:29 pm
Bar in Nighthawks should probably have been accepted upon protest, right?
I don't think I lodged a protest, but they were looking for restaurant of diner. I don't think the protest would have mattered anyway.
FWIW, I said "the bar in Nighthawks" and it was accepted, although I heard that most people who said that were negged. I also looked it up on QuizDB and saw that there were a number of older questions that referred to the building as a bar, so it seems to be a bit ambiguous to me.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Auks Ran Ova » Wed May 29, 2019 10:21 pm

Ike wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 9:56 pm
I would recommend using an identifier such as "This unnamed location" if you're going to write a tossup on something that doesn't have a reified name. It feels much less hacky than saying "description acceptable."
All else equal I would think a simple tag like "description acceptable" would be much easier to understand for an average relatively non-savvy player than a potentially-confusing phrase like "this unnamed location", though I think both can certainly work if the question is written clearly enough.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by touchpack » Wed May 29, 2019 10:27 pm

A_Failure wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 9:57 pm
thederpyaxolotl wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 9:34 pm
Cheynem wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 9:29 pm
Bar in Nighthawks should probably have been accepted upon protest, right?
I don't think I lodged a protest, but they were looking for restaurant of diner. I don't think the protest would have mattered anyway.
FWIW, I said "the bar in Nighthawks" and it was accepted, although I heard that most people who said that were negged. I also looked it up on QuizDB and saw that there were a number of older questions that referred to the building as a bar, so it seems to be a bit ambiguous to me.
It absolutely should have been accepted, because the answerline communicated that putative synonyms for "diner" are acceptable (see the phrase "the notion of" below), but unfortunately "bar" was not listed among them, so it seems some moderators quickly scanning the answerline did not pick up on that. FWIW I think "this unnamed location" is a good solution that clearly and concisely communicates that we were looking for a description, sorry about that!

answer: (the) _diner_ in _Nighthawks_ (accept answers indicating both _Nighthawks_ and the notion of a diner or caf\'e or restaurant; prompt on "diner" or similar answers that don't mention the painting; prompt on "(the building in) Nighthawks")
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by jonpin » Wed May 29, 2019 10:37 pm

Important Bird Area wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 4:49 pm
CPiGuy wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 4:41 pm
As a moderator, I noticed that this set had a much higher frequency of copyediting issues that interfered with my ability to read -- there was an omitted preposition/article, an instance of "the that" or something like that, or something along those lines almost every round, and sometimes several times in a packet. In several cases it seemed like the question had been edited to change a word but that they hadn't done it the whole way, if that makes sense. I also noticed this problem at MSNCT. The only one I specifically remember was a tossup on Chile that began with "This sea off this country" or something along those lines, which required me to stop the clock and read the question to figure out what the pronoun actually was.
Our apologies for the copyediting issues present in this year's national championships; please feel free to send us details (errata@naqt.com or feel free to contact me directly).
This is basically impossible for almost anyone who moderated to do, as we're not permitted to have copies of the packets after the tournament's over. Unless you would like us to try to take notes on grammatical or factual errors during a match, we're not going to be able to give more than vague memories after the fact.
CPiGuy wrote:
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On another note on that question, I'm a huge fan of NAQT adopting verbose prompts!
Within reason. When an answer line reaches three lines of text, it doesn't matter if we've been given a note to "look over this answer line in advance", it's going to be difficult to parse in real-time. Those advance notes are much appreciated, but seemed arbitrary at times (there were a handful of questions with complicated lines that didn't get such a note; one that particularly caught my attention was on optimization which, deep into the second line of answer text, said "accept maximization or minimization before mention" or something like that).
In general, though, I'm always a fan of giving someone a prompt and a chance to prove they know or don't know what they're talking about right then.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by touchpack » Wed May 29, 2019 10:46 pm

jonpin wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 10:37 pm
CPiGuy wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 5:04 pm
On another note on that question, I'm a huge fan of NAQT adopting verbose prompts!
Within reason. When an answer line reaches three lines of text, it doesn't matter if we've been given a note to "look over this answer line in advance", it's going to be difficult to parse in real-time. Those advance notes are much appreciated, but seemed arbitrary at times (there were a handful of questions with complicated lines that didn't get such a note; one that particularly caught my attention was on optimization which, deep into the second line of answer text, said "accept maximization or minimization before mention" or something like that).
In general, though, I'm always a fan of giving someone a prompt and a chance to prove they know or don't know what they're talking about right then.
What Conor is referring to is prompts that require the moderator to say something other than the word "prompt" to more efficiently direct the player towards the answer. (For example, the time derivative tossup had a prompt on _derivative_ saying "with respect to what variable?") This is a good practice because while in some cases (say, names of monarchs), it's very clear what additional information to add when prompted, in other cases it can be quite unclear, making the prompt unhelpful. Another example is the answerline to the _nuclei_ tossup, listed below:

answer: atomic _nucleus_ (or atomic _nuclei_; prompt on "effective nuclear charge"; before "0.35," prompt on "atoms" or "crystals" or "solids" by asking "what part of the atom/crystal/solid?")
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Cheynem » Wed May 29, 2019 11:30 pm

I messed up the prompting rules for the tossup on the October Revolution, neglecting to prompt when somebody said "November Revolution." That said, I have two questions:

1. Could someone really figure out what to say upon being prompted on "November Revolution" (i.e., that you want "October")?

2. Is there some reason why "November Revolution of 1917" is not an acceptable answer by itself?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Ike » Thu May 30, 2019 7:25 am

Auks Ran Ova wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 10:21 pm
Ike wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 9:56 pm
I would recommend using an identifier such as "This unnamed location" if you're going to write a tossup on something that doesn't have a reified name. It feels much less hacky than saying "description acceptable."
All else equal I would think a simple tag like "description acceptable" would be much easier to understand for an average relatively non-savvy player than a potentially-confusing phrase like "this unnamed location", though I think both can certainly work if the question is written clearly enough.
NAQT explicitly does not allow for the use of description acceptable tags. Not wading into whether that's good policy, my point about the description acceptable is that it's often much cleaner to use a phrase like "this unnamed location" than "description acceptable" because description acceptable often means "read my mind to figure out what you want." I'm reminded of a tossup on the _magistrate_ or _narrator_ of ~Waiting for the Barbarians~ which began with a "Description acceptable" tag, and prompted on an answer of "the protagonist of ~Waiting for the Barbarians~_" In this case, it almost feels like the tag should be "Some descriptions acceptable. Buzz at your own risk."
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Thu May 30, 2019 9:13 am

joshxu wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 7:16 pm
Can I see the Turkmenistan (round 1), Bounty Mutiny (round 7), Lake Texcoco (round 7), and Red Sea (round 22) tossups, and the Brunei bonus (round 20)?

Edit: In light of Mike Bentley's post, the reason why I want to see the four tossups is that I feel I could [should?] have powered them all, and I want to see where power ended. For the Brunei bonus, the second part had "Brunei" as its answer and named the sultan in the question as a clue. Two players on my team know that Hassanal Bolkiah is the current sultan of Brunei, but neither of us recognized the name of the sultan the question gave. I'm interested whether 1) both of us misheard the name or 2) a different name for the same person was given.
2019 HSNCT round 1 wrote:This country's traditional attire includes an afro-like sheepskin hat known as the "telpek." The Neutrality Monument in this country's capital is topped by a gold-plated statue of its former dictator who wrote the Ruhnama. The "Door to (*) Hell" is a fiery pit of natural gas in the Karakum Desert of this country, which was once ruled by Saparmurat Niyazov. For 10 points—what Central Asian country's capital is Ashgabat?
2019 HSNCT round 7 wrote:Several perpetrators of this event, including Peter Heywood, were on board the ship Pandora when it sank near the Great Barrier Reef. A 1932 novel named for this event was written by Charles Nordhoff and James Hall. This event occurred during a voyage to acquire (*) breadfruit in Tahiti. Fletcher Christian settled on Pitcairn Island after—for 10 points—what event, during which William Bligh was set adrift by his crew?

answer: mutiny on the Bounty (accept all answers indicating a mutiny onboard the HMS Bounty)
2019 HSNCT round 7 wrote:According to Bernal Diaz, this lake's southwest was once separated by a 10-mile-long causeway from a more saline portion. This lake lay north of the freshwater lake Chalco, the site of "floating gardens" called (*) chinampas. The volcano Popocatepetl overlooked this lake, where an eagle holding a snake legendarily landed atop a cactus. For 10 points—name this lake that was the site of the Aztec city of Tenochtitlan.
2019 HSNCT round 19 wrote:This sea's islands of Nakura and Kebir, which house notorious prison camps for political dissidents, are part of its Dahlak Archipelago. A disputed region known as the Hala'ib Triangle is on the western shore of this sea, which is connected at its southern end by the (*) Bab-el-Mandeb Strait to the Gulf of Aden. The Suez Canal links the Mediterranean Sea with—for 10 points—what sea that in the Bible is parted by Moses?
2019 HSNCT round 20 wrote:The proposed use of this punishment prompted a 2019 boycott against the Beverly Hills Hotel. For 10 points each—

A. Identify this form of capital punishment enforced by authorities in several Islamic countries, particularly for adultery.

answer: (death by) stoning (accept lapidation or rajm; accept being stoned to death)

B. The new punishments are part of this efforts by Hassanal Bolkiah, the sultan of this country, to enforce strict Sharia.

C. In Brunei, stoning is also applicable for those who participate in this other action, which was made legal in Ireland in 2018 by the repeal of the Eighth Amendment.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Thu May 30, 2019 9:14 am

bolshevik wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 7:37 pm
Could I see the tossup from the finals on “Dark Souls”? That’s my favorite game (and also I couldn’t tell what was being asked about in the first clue)
2019 HSNCT round 31 wrote:This title entity distinguishes a man who is "coming to you on a dusty road" in a Sam & Dave song. The player awakens in the Northern Undead Asylum in a video game whose title refers to these things. "Double consciousness" is examined in a (*) W. E. B. Du Bois book named for these things "of Black Folk." The poem "Invictus" declares "I am the captain of"—for 10 points—what incorporeal entity contrasted with mind and body?

answer: souls (accept Soul Man or Dark Souls or The Souls of Black Folk; accept I am the captain of my soul) [The Northern Undead Asylum is the starting area of Dark Souls.]
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Thu May 30, 2019 9:17 am

thederpyaxolotl wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 8:50 pm
Could I see the tossups on calcite and the one that started with a character being beaten to death for saying 2+2=4? I was negged on the first one in power (specifically at stalactite, if I remember correctly) with Calcium Carbonate and protested, but it ended up being moot. The second one my teammate negged and I just wanted to see the question again.
2019 HSNCT round 4 wrote:This mineral gave its name to seas in the Early Paleozoic Era that were relatively low in magnesium. A variety of this mineral called Iceland spar exhibits birefringence. Aragonite is a polymorph of this mineral, which is the main component of most (*) stalactites and stalagmites, as well as of the rock limestone. For 10 points—name this mineral with a hardness of 3 on the Mohs [mohz] scale, whose chemical formula is CaCO3.

answer: calcite [KAL-"sight"] (accept calcite seas; prompt on "calcium carbonate"; prompt on "CaCO3" before "CaCO3"; do not accept or prompt on "limestone")
2019 HSNCT 18 wrote:This novel imagines a person being "punished by death" for saying that 2 + 2 = 4. In this novel's fourth part, an actor collapses during a performance of Orpheus and Eurydice and a priest gives a sermon about the suffering of innocent children. In this novel, Father Paneloux's death in (*) Oran is attributed to an unknown illness by the doctor Bernard Rieux. For 10 points—name this Albert Camus novel about an epidemic.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Cody » Thu May 30, 2019 10:00 am

touchpack wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 10:27 pm
It absolutely should have been accepted, because the answerline communicated that putative synonyms for "diner" are acceptable (see the phrase "the notion of" below), but unfortunately "bar" was not listed among them, so it seems some moderators quickly scanning the answerline did not pick up on that. FWIW I think "this unnamed location" is a good solution that clearly and concisely communicates that we were looking for a description, sorry about that!

answer: (the) _diner_ in _Nighthawks_ (accept answers indicating both _Nighthawks_ and the notion of a diner or caf\'e or restaurant; prompt on "diner" or similar answers that don't mention the painting; prompt on "(the building in) Nighthawks")
This answerline does a disservice to moderators because the "notion of a diner, cafe, or restaurant" is completely subjective and ill-defined -- it's very hard to adjudicate if you haven't seen the painting. I would go so far to say that a bar is not in the "notion of" a diner, cafe, or restaurant, as there exists a trivial distinction in their primary purposes (again, if you haven't seen the painting). Moderators aren't always going to be able to pick up the slack on underspecified answerlines, and the alternate answers should've been spelled out more fully here. (And more generally, heeding the old HSAPQ rule that accepting "obvious equivalents" -- and similar constructions -- can only ever be done when the equivalents are indeed very obvious to the set of people reading the tournament.)
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by John Ketzkorn » Thu May 30, 2019 12:58 pm

Ike wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 7:25 am
Auks Ran Ova wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 10:21 pm
Ike wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 9:56 pm
I would recommend using an identifier such as "This unnamed location" if you're going to write a tossup on something that doesn't have a reified name. It feels much less hacky than saying "description acceptable."
All else equal I would think a simple tag like "description acceptable" would be much easier to understand for an average relatively non-savvy player than a potentially-confusing phrase like "this unnamed location", though I think both can certainly work if the question is written clearly enough.
NAQT explicitly does not allow for the use of description acceptable tags. Not wading into whether that's good policy, my point about the description acceptable is that it's often much cleaner to use a phrase like "this unnamed location" than "description acceptable" because description acceptable often means "read my mind to figure out what you want." I'm reminded of a tossup on the _magistrate_ or _narrator_ of ~Waiting for the Barbarians~ which began with a "Description acceptable" tag, and prompted on an answer of "the protagonist of ~Waiting for the Barbarians~_" In this case, it almost feels like the tag should be "Some descriptions acceptable. Buzz at your own risk."
If the tossup were just on "this unnamed character" I think you still reach the same pitfall. Both effectively have the same merits with "Description Acceptable" more explicitly cluing you the fact you can give a general description of what's going on. I'd be baffled if I had heard a tossup on "this unnamed x" cold. But "unnamed" seems fine (if not slightly confusing for new players) in the NAQT context.

With regards to the Nighthawks tossup, having some mention of bar explicitly would have prevented many negs, since even though I've seen the painting, I was confused as to whether or not the building itself could be classified as a bar. I scorekept that round, but didn't say anything contrary to the moderator's ruling since I thought we were just tossing up the entire building and since the bar is within the building, the answer given wasn't wholly correct. Is there any particular reason other than boredom that this wasn't a plain tossup on Nighthawks?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Fri May 31, 2019 8:23 am

jaguar19 wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 8:57 pm
Could I see tossups on Joshua Tree (Round 1), assassination of RFK (Round 2), Gorbachev (Round 2), American flags (Round 3), Life of Pi (Round 3), murder of John Lennon (Round 5), Lewinsky scandal (Round 7), Guyana (Round 16), George H.W. Bush (Round 17), and Hubert Humphrey (Round 20)?
2019 HSNCT round 1 wrote:A song on this album pleads "hear their heartbeat" in reference to the Central American mothers of kidnapped children. A trip to Nicaragua and El Salvador inspired this album's song "Bullet the (*) Blue Sky." The claim "I have climbed the highest mountains" is made in "I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For," which, like "Where the Streets Have No Name," appears on—for 10 points—what U2 album named for a Mojave plant?
2019 HSNCT round 2 wrote:This event occurred during a handshake with teenager Juan Romero in the middle of a walk led by maitre d' Karl Uecker. Just prior to this event, its victim declared "on to Chicago, and let's win there!" in a speech celebrating victory in the (*) California primary, before entering the kitchen of the Ambassador Hotel. For 10 points—name this 1968 event in which Sirhan Sirhan killed a Democratic presidential candidate.

answer: assassination of Robert F(rancis) Kennedy (accept answers that include Robert Kennedy and the notion of killing or murder or shooting or death; accept RFK or Bobby Kennedy in place of Robert Kennedy; prompt on answers that only include "Kennedy" and the notion of assassination)
2019 HSNCT round 2 wrote:A chemist named Nina Andreyeva denounced this world leader's policies in the essay "I Cannot Forsake My Principles." This leader's spokesman used the phrase "Sinatra Doctrine" to describe a new relationship with allies. The Gang of Eight's August Coup targeted this leader in (*) 1991. Policies translated as "openness" and "restructuring"—glasnost and perestroika—were advocated by—for 10 points—what final leader of the USSR?
2019 HSNCT round 3 wrote:Several of these objects hang in the upper half of Childe Hassam's painting The Avenue in the Rain. The best-known photographs by both Thomas Franklin and Joe Rosenthal depict diagonally-oriented examples of these objects. A newspaper collage underlays a 1954 (*) encaustic painting of one of these objects by Jasper Johns. A photo atop Mount Suribachi on Iwo Jima shows the "raising" of—for 10 points—what national symbol?

answer: American flag(s) (accept all answers indicating the flag of the United States of America or U.S.A (accept any underlined portion); accept the Stars and Stripes; accept Old Glory; prompt on "flag(s)" or "flagpole(s)" or other partial answers)
2019 HSNCT round 3 wrote:Two short chapters in this novel argue that agnostics "miss the better story" because they hold on to "dry, yeastless factuality." This 2001 novel's protagonist remarks that green is "the color of Islam" after seeing an island of (*) algae where he discovers balls of leaves that contain human teeth. A Frenchman is devoured by the shipwrecked Bengal tiger Richard Parker in—for 10 points—what novel by Yann Martel?
2019 HSNCT round 5 wrote:Jared Leto plays the perpetrator of this crime in the 2007 film Chapter 27. During a Monday Night Football game, Howard Cosell announced this crime had occurred at New York City's Dakota Apartments. The perpetrator of this crime wrote "This is my statement" in a copy of The (*) Catcher in the Rye that he read before his arrest. For 10 points—what 1980 crime was committed by Mark David Chapman against a former Beatle?

answer: murder of John (Winston) Lennon (accept assassinating John Lennon or killing John Lennon or other answers that mention John Lennon and the notion of his murder or homicide)
2019 HSNCT round 7 wrote:During this scandal, Larry Flynt's campaign to expose Republican misdeeds led Bob Livingston to resign from Congress. One figure in this scandal was urged by a friend not to dry clean an incriminating blue garment. The Drudge Report first broke this scandal, which began after (*) Linda Tripp gave secret phone recordings to Kenneth Starr. For 10 points—name this sex scandal that led to Bill Clinton's impeachment.

answer: Monica Lewinsky scandal (accept answers identifying a scandal centering on Monica Lewinsky; accept Clinton-Lewinsky affair or Lewinskygate or Monicagate; prompt on "(Bill) Clinton's (sex) (scandal) (with an intern)" or similar answers that don't mention Lewinsky or Monica; prompt on "impeachment of Bill Clinton" or similar answers that mention "impeachment" or equivalents but not "Lewinsky" prior to "impeachment"; do not accept or prompt on "Whitewater (scandal)" or "Whitewatergate" or "Starr investigation")
2019 HSNCT round 16 wrote:This country exports a cassava syrup called cassareep, which is used in its national dish of pepperpot. This country is bisected by its largest river, the Essequibo. In 1895 Grover Cleveland appointed a commission to resolve a dispute over its still-mostly-impassable western border with (*) Venezuela. English is the official language of—for 10 points—what small South American country whose capital is Georgetown?
2019 HSNCT round 17 wrote:This man, who was known as "the bicycle-riding envoy" during his time in Beijing, sent Brent Scowcroft on a secret mission to reaffirm relations with China after the Tiananmen Square massacre. This politician, who referred to community groups as a (*) "thousand points of light," ordered a troop buildup in Operation Desert Shield after the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait. For 10 points—what man was president during the First Gulf War?
2019 HSNCT round 20 wrote:In 1977 the ceremonial post of "deputy president pro tempore" was created for this senator. While a mayor, this man defended a civil rights platform at the 1948 Democratic National Convention. When he ran for president, this man chose not to reveal accusations that peace talks in (*) Vietnam had been sabotaged by his opponent, Richard Nixon. For 10 points—name this Minnesota senator who was Lyndon Johnson's vice president.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Fri May 31, 2019 8:26 am

Cheynem wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 11:30 pm
I messed up the prompting rules for the tossup on the October Revolution, neglecting to prompt when somebody said "November Revolution." That said, I have two questions:

1. Could someone really figure out what to say upon being prompted on "November Revolution" (i.e., that you want "October")?

2. Is there some reason why "November Revolution of 1917" is not an acceptable answer by itself?
We should probably have taken "November Revolution of 1917" outright.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Ehtna » Fri May 31, 2019 9:32 am

Can I see the bonus from round 12 or so about Snow Crash and the bonus from round 16 that was something along the lines of "authors who wrote about girls named Emma"? The Snow Crash one just completely lost me, and I wanted to read the Emma bonus again to see what exactly merited Bon Iver being an answer in what I'd assume is a literature bonus.
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by jonathanshauf » Fri May 31, 2019 9:43 am

Could I see the religion tossup on fools?
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Important Bird Area » Fri May 31, 2019 10:07 am

2019 HSNCT round 16 wrote:This character meets "Yours Truly," who goes by "Y.T.," while making a pizza delivery for the Mafia. For 10 points each—

A. Identify this main character of a 1992 novel, who has a punningly appropriate name.

B. Hiro Protagonist appears in this cyberpunk novel by Neal Stephenson, titled for a digital virus-slash-narcotic.

C. In 1994 Snow Crash won a British science fiction award named for this author. The A.I. HAL 9000 appears in his novel 2001: A Space Odyssey.
2019 HSNCT round 16 wrote:For 10 points each—answer the following about works titled for people named Emma:

A. This author began, but never completed, a manuscript titled for a mysterious girl named Emma. Her completed novels include Jane Eyre.

B. In Jane Austen's novel Emma, the title character is briefly involved with Frank Churchill before actually marrying this man, who is 17 years her senior.

C. This Wisconsin-based indie band released the debut album For Emma, Forever Ago in 2007. This group's most-recent album is 2016's 22, A Million
(this was a miscellaneous bonus)
2019 HSNCT round 21 wrote:According to Ecclesiastes, "anger lodges in the heart of" these people. In Psalms these people are quoted as saying "there is no God." Proverbs 26 says there is "no good way to answer" these people, whose repeated missteps are likened to dogs (*) returning to their vomit. Paul told the Corinthians not to "suffer" these people "gladly." For 10 points—name these people whose actions are contrasted in Proverbs with those of "wise men."

answer: fools (or foolish men; do not accept or prompt on putative synonyms)
Jeff Hoppes
President, Northern California Quiz Bowl Alliance
former HSQB Chief Admin (2012-13)
VP for Communication and history subject editor, NAQT
Editor emeritus, ACF

"I wish to make some kind of joke about Jeff's love of birds, but I always fear he'll turn them on me Hitchcock-style." -Fred

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Marble-faced Bristle Tyrant
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Re: 2019 HSNCT discussion

Post by Marble-faced Bristle Tyrant » Fri May 31, 2019 12:48 pm

Can we see the question text for the Nighthawks bar? I don't think it's actually been posted here.
Farrah Bilimoria
Formerly of Georgia Tech and Central High School (Macon)

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