Announcement: Brandeis Mirror of Deep Bench, 10/20

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:34 am

Brandeis will be hosting a mirror of this year's Deep Bench, to be held on October 20.

Ideally, we'd like to maintain the format, but this depends on how many teams we can get to have 8 players. If necessary, we'll combine teams from two different schools, or we can modify the format to be (2x doubles or 2x singles/1x doubles) and 1x quad, but I'd like to avoid that. The formatting description can be found in this thread.

We will be running the tournament entirely on Saturday, based on the number of teams it appears we will have.

So far, the following clubs have said they will bring a team:

Brown (8 people)
MIT (15-17 people)
Harvard (8 people)
Maryland (5 people)
Amherst (6 people)

The fees will be as follows:

Base fee (for one eight-person team): $110
Buzzer system: -$5 each
Moderator: -$10 each for a full time moderator; we'll have teams moderating during bye rounds if we have an odd number, so no discount for that
Travel: negotiable, send me an email if you're coming from outside New England
There will be no packet-writing for the mirror.

We will meet in Lown Auditorium at 9:00 AM. The tournament will take place in two adjacent buildings, Lown and Shiffman. Directions to the campus can be found on this page, while the location on campus of the buildings can be seen on the campus map.

To register, or for any questions, email me at enagler at brandeis dot edu.

If you are thinking about coming, but have not let me know, please do so sooner rather than later.

Thanks,

Evan Nagler
Brandeis Quiz Bowl

Kyle · Post by **Kyle** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 10:41 am

We'll bring at least one team as well. Thanks for putting this on - it should be an exciting break from the usual format!

Dartmouth College Bowl · Thu Aug 16, 2007 12:40 pm

That's our homecoming weekend, but we should probably bring at least a team of 4.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:26 pm

Dartmouth College Bowl wrote:That's our homecoming weekend, but we should probably bring at least a team of 4.

Alright...perhaps we'll supplement it with MIT B or the new Deis kids. We'll see how many people we've got coming and if we have any free agents, etc.

The Logic of Scientific Disco · Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:34 pm

Supplementing sounds like a good idea--it's much more likely that we'll be able to bring 3 or 4 extras in addition to the first team than a full second team of 8. But we can figure this out in more detail closer to the date, once we actually have freshmen...

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 7:39 am

Bump, since I've updated the start time and location on campus, and given links to directions and a campus map.

grapesmoker · Post by **grapesmoker** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 11:13 am

Just to let you know, Brown will bring a team.

Mike Bentley · Post by **Mike Bentley** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 11:44 am

Maryland is considering bringing anywhere from 0 to 1 teams (by which I mean it's possible we'll bring a team of fourish people). It will depend on transportation and how many people are willing to take most of Friday off to drive up to Brandeis. I wouldn't schedule your tournament around us, but we'd prefer a one day event to a multi-day event.

Post by **DumbJaques** » Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:41 pm

It seems pretty unlikely to me that teams will realistically be producing 8 people. What would be the problem with doing something like 1 quad/2 singles/ 1 double per team of four? It seems to maintain the spirit of the deep bench format while making things realistic for the mirror site.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Mon Sep 10, 2007 8:35 am

DumbJaques wrote:It seems pretty unlikely to me that teams will realistically be producing 8 people. What would be the problem with doing something like 1 quad/2 singles/ 1 double per team of four? It seems to maintain the spirit of the deep bench format while making things realistic for the mirror site.

Chris, that was what I'd proposed in the email I sent: that if people can't get teams of eight, we could do 4/1-1-2 instead. One issue is that this increases the number of matches that need to be played, when we may be a little strapped on staff. The other thing is that Brown, Harvard, and MIT seem convinced they will be able to bring full 8-man teams, with MIT thinking they may get two full 8-man teams.

The other option, which I was probably going to use, is to combine four-man teams, then preserve the 8/2-2-2-1-1 format. Once registrations are completely finished, we'll figure out something. For right now, we're still waiting on schools to tell us an accurate number of people they've got coming.

Anyway, with the list we've got right now, we have enough for five 8-person teams if we combine Dartmouth's and Maryland's half-team. This is a desirable number of teams for the tournament to run smoothly, but if you have a problem with combining teams, that's fair, and you should let me know.

Mike Bentley · Post by **Mike Bentley** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 1:14 pm

Hey Evan, you can officially put us down for bringing a half team (either 4 or 5 players).

Post by **DumbJaques** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:12 pm

I think it might be pretty fun to combine our team with Dartmouth, if the numbers work out that way. Do you have a new field update?

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 7:01 pm

DumbJaques wrote:I think it might be pretty fun to combine our team with Dartmouth, if the numbers work out that way. Do you have a new field update?

No field update, other than yours. I'll send out a pestering email in the next few days to try and get a better update. There is some potential interest from Amherst, but they haven't followed up. We'll see how it goes.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Fri Oct 05, 2007 1:42 pm

OK, I need to set a deadline on registration and number of people changes for logistical reasons. If you have not yet registered, please do so by Thursday, Oct. 11. If you have registered, please confirm your number of people who are coming by that date as well. If you need information for making hotel arrangements or for driving directions, let me know and I'll give you what you need.

Thanks.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 11:16 am

If you are coming to this event, lunch options include the semi-open Brandeis dining halls, the Prime Deli, and Cappy's Pizza, both of which are decent walks from where the tournament is held.

The staff will be ordering pizza. If you would like to order pizza as well, let me know what specifically you would like by, say, Oct. 18, and bring cash to pay for it (+MA 5% sales tax + tip). That way, we can have it all arrive at the same time. We will probably just get Cappy's, since they're close to campus and it will therefore be hot.

The menu for Cappy's is available online here.

They have a discount if we order a lot of pizza, too, so let me know sooner rather than later.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 10:22 pm

Bump because of an update to the field (see first post). Still waiting on Dartmouth's tally. It looks like we may have to split one of the Amherst, Maryland, or Dartmouth teams to get two full 8-person teams. Once Dartmouth gives me the info, I'll let people know and see what the best solution is.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 8:32 pm

Bump to say Dartmouth dropped out of the tournament. Harvard will hopefully provide some extras to fill out teams.

Also, for every team involved with a set lineup, please email me with the designations for everyone. I'd like to have this information by Wednesday if at all possible.

Thanks.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:23 pm

Results without stats:

Quads A
Harvard 4-1
Brown 4-1
Maryland 3-2
MIT 1 3-2
MIT 2 0-5
Amherst 1-4

Quads B
Harvard 4-1
Brown 3-4
MIT 1 5-0
MIT 2 1-4
Maryland 1-4
Amherst 2-3

Doubles A
Amherst 0-5
Brown 4-1
Harvard 3-2
Maryland 4-1
MIT 1 3-2
MIT 2 1-4

Doubles B
Amherst 1-4
Brown 4-1
Harvard 4-1
Maryland 1-4
MIT 1 3-2
MIT 2 2-3

Doubles C
Amherst 3-2
Brown 3-2
Harvard 4-1
Maryland 1-4
MIT 1 3-2
MIT 2 1-4

Singles A
Amherst 4-1
Brown 3-2
Harvard 2-3
MIT 1 0-5
MIT 2 1-4
Maryland 5-0

Singles B
Amherst 1-4
Brown 2-3
Harvard 4-1
Maryland 5-0
MIT 1 2-3
MIT 2 1-4

Overall
1. Harvard, 105 points
2. Brown, 100 points
3. Maryland, 91 points
4. MIT 1, 79 points
5. Amherst, 50 points
6. MIT 2, 25 points

Stats are completed for Singles A and Quads A, but not yet uploaded. Due to a lot of inexperienced moderators, there seem to be a few scoresheets missing, so stats for the other brackets may be missing games and therefore less accurate than we'd like.

Thanks to everyone who came.

Evan Nagler
Brandeis Quiz Bowl

Edit: fixed the fact that Kyle (Harvard Singles A) was left out

Kyle · Post by **Kyle** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 9:21 pm

DeisEvan wrote: Singles A
Amherst 4-1
Brown 3-2
MIT 1 0-5
MIT 2 1-4
Maryland 5-0

I love how I'm the only person left out of your results, Evan.

Thanks, in any event, to Brandeis for putting this on. This was an interesting format to play and it produced a lot of fun games with some strange results.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 10:02 pm

I'd also like to thank Evan and the rest of the Brandeis crew for holding this tournament. It ran fairly smoothly and didn't end at an obscene time; besides, who doesn't like eating pizza while hearing questions at lunch?

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 11:25 pm

Stats, which are definitely incomplete for several brackets due to missing scoresheets (sorry):

Edit: I should note, Quads A and Singles A are almost certainly accurate. The others are prone to missing games; I haven't inspected them yet.

Edit 2: Quads B also appear to be accurate. Doubles A and B each seem to be missing one game, while Doubles C is definitely messed up; Amherst couldn't have played six games. Singles B are also seemingly accurate. Also, ignore the "tossups heard" and "PPTUH", since when I was inputting stats I put the "20 TUH", but other people did not, so it's meaningless.

Unnecessary tidbit: in the Doubles A stats, Eric's name should have "of Science" at the end, but it was messing up in SQBS.

Doubles A
Doubles B
Doubles C
Singles A
Singles B
Quads A
Quads B

Sima Guang Hater · Post by **Sima Guang Hater** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 12:47 am

I like how Marco is entered as "Mario". And an excellently run tournament; all of our moderators were very competent.

Jeremy Gibbs Lemma · Post by **Jeremy Gibbs Lemma** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 1:28 am

I like how you are the only one to get an impressive name

His Holiness Sri Sri Lord Eric Mukherjee .... idk if I will be able to refer to you as that very often though because I wouldn't feel like typing all that out or even saying it for that matter.

The Logic of Scientific Disco · Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:16 am

I have the following for Doubles B, MIT 1 vs. MIT 2 (the missing game):

MIT 1 90, MIT 2 70
MIT 1: John Paul 9 2 80, Antonin 2 2 10
MIT 2: Marianne 2 0 20, Tuck 5 0 50

Overall, I thought this tournament was pretty good--some of the staffers for the singles/doubles rounds were kind of shaky, but that's to be expected for a tournament that requires this many moderators. Definitely enjoyed a lot of things, especially finally getting our buzzers back after Harvard left them at Brown 3 weeks ago...

Kyle · Post by **Kyle** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 9:41 am

ChrisK.MIT wrote:Definitely enjoyed a lot of things, especially finally getting our buzzers back after Harvard left them at Brown 3 weeks ago...

You mean after Yi Sun left them at Brown 3 weeks ago. Credit where credit is due.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 10:16 am

As far as the moderating is concerned, we had basically everyone who regularly attends meetings, including many people who'd never read before, and some friends of people in the club (who also had no experience) helping out for the morning, so criticism of them is not really necessary. If there was a problem with any of the Singles A or Quads A moderating (the most experienced moderators), please let me know, preferably via e-mail.

Also, it's interesting to have new moderators try and do it with no buzzers, as there was no way we could get 15 buzzer systems...

One more thing: for anyone else using inexperienced moderators in the future, despite its age, the old ACF readers' guide is an excellent resource to make people read, as long as you give the "bonus answers are usually given after each part" caveat.

Edit: sorry for any name misspellings in the stats; some people were less careful about spelling for roster entry in SQBS, apparently, leading to stuff like "Sofia/Sophia" in her two brackets, and "Mario" instead of Marko.

Skepticism and Animal Feed · Sun Oct 21, 2007 10:30 am

Yeah, what can you really do about moderating and Deep Bench? Because it's eight person teams, schools that show up need every warm body they can muster, and therefore can't really be expected to bring moderators. And because there are so many games, you need a lot of moderators.

Mike Bentley · Post by **Mike Bentley** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 10:55 am

Thanks to Brandeis for holding a very well run tournament. Obviously everyone would like more experienced moderators, but when you have 15 rooms to run, it's not going to happen. If you guys how this tournament again, I'd suggest making it clear to teams that they should bring as many buzzers as possible. We could have potentially brought more had we known there was a need for it. And if you actually said this in an e-mail or a post and I just forgot about it, then my bad.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 11:30 am

Another note from the TD's experience with yesterday's tournament: remember next time to print out infinity copies of the schedule and infinity scoresheets.

Mike, I guess I wasn't clear about the buzzer situation, but it worked out. It's usually less important to have buzzers in a singles or doubles match because they're much less likely to have buzzer races. At least all the quads matches had buzzers, anyway.

And Bruce, if we'd had an odd number of teams, we would have had a bye each round, and that's six to eight extras each round based on the sizes of teams we had yesterday. Granted, many players are inexperienced moderators, but it would have alleviated some staffing difficulties.

Sima Guang Hater · Post by **Sima Guang Hater** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:43 pm

Also, the Harvard-MIT game in Quads A seems a bit irregular. Can anyone corroborate that score?

Oh yeah, and we're going to miss using MIT's buzzers, because they worked.

And Evan, singles/doubles matches are just as likely to have buzzer races, especially with the difficulty of that set. The Pellon-Mukherjee-Magin match exemplifies this; we also didn't have any buzzers, which made it worse.

The Logic of Scientific Disco · Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:36 pm

For the Harvard-MIT 1 game, the score is right but the Harvard stats are off. I have them going 3-5-5 on tossups (not 3-15-4), which should make everything add up (it should also up their bonus conversion to something reasonable). The numbers for MIT 1 are right in that game, though. I think the error lies in John's 0-11-0 line, which is probably supposed to be 0-1-1.

Not That Kind of Christian!! · Sun Oct 21, 2007 6:01 pm

As primary statkeeper, I'm sorry for those errors. I'll fix any errors that people have pointed out to Evan and repost the stats.

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 7:12 pm

Bump to let people know the suggested corrections have been made. There are still a couple of matches missing, but we're not sure what we can do about that now.

Sima Guang Hater · Post by **Sima Guang Hater** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:07 am

anyone want to enlighten me on what MITs clever naming theme was this time around

wd4gdz · Post by **wd4gdz** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:26 am

Well, it appears some are Supreme Court justices...anyone else known the other connection?

pray for elves · Post by **pray for elves** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:23 am

MIT 1 was Supreme Court Justices. I never had MIT 2 due to a scheduling quirk, so since I didn't enter most of the stats, I don't know what their theme was.

DakarKra · Post by **DakarKra** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 9:01 am

Looks like MIT 2 was Robin Hood.

The Logic of Scientific Disco · Mon Oct 22, 2007 11:06 am

Yeah, MIT 1 was supposed to be Supreme Court justices, but some of the Quads B people didn't get into the loop fast enough and used real names for the day. MIT 2 was indeed Robin Hood, though, with the added bonus that some people were actually using their real names.

Mike Bentley · Post by **Mike Bentley** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:55 pm

Ok, these matches are now up on the podcast (check the link in the blog). You guys should check out Round 8 where I hilariously mix up the answers to about 5 different questions. Thanks to my new recording device, the audio quality of these matches should be better than in the past.

EFT and Maryland's Fall HS Tournament will be coming later.